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<br>
Hi Romy-<br>
<br>
Yeah, I'd be willing to do it under whatever formalities were
appropriate, and in whatever form was appropriate, as long as the
schedule was reasonable (evenings/nights any day of the week work
for me, subject to my work schedule). The simplest format for me
would be talk + Q&A, with slides to project, and with some
physical hardware to demonstrate a few things. <br>
<br>
I already have contact with the folks who are working on 510 because
I'm working on a community mesh network project called CTel, for
Cooperative Telephone & Telegraph (data communication is
telegraphy). <br>
<br>
CTel will be a combined worker- & subscriber-owned cooperative,
providing voice & data service in direct competition to major
carriers, and creating right-livelihood jobs from the get-go. We'll
be seeking a starting base of 2,000 subscribers to get going, but
the network could grow to tens of thousands. The project will be
self-funding rather than relying on outside capital with strings
attached. It will be structurally immune to being sold out to a
large corporation or other external ownership, thus it will always
remain a community-owned network.<br>
<br>
CTel is being designed to be user-friendly for people without
technical backgrounds, a drop-in replacement for existing landline,
mobile, and broadband. For example the young single mother trying
to work and go to college, the 80-year-old retiree, the working
family on a tight budget, the military veteran newly returned to
civilian life, and Main Street local businesses that serve the
community. If we can serve those folks successfully, we're on the
right track. <br>
<br>
CTel's worker-owners will provide regular and reliable customer
support and network maintenance, so the network keeps on working
rather than slowly pooping out after the initial excitement wears
off.<br>
<br>
The primary value of volunteer mesh projects such as 510pen is to
enable hackers/makers to experiment and develop new applications,
push the cutting edge, and try things that would be risky in a fully
deployed public network. This is the aspect that I've found most of
the local mesh activists are interested in, and they should be free
to do it without getting stuck with unpaid jobs having to operate
and maintain a network, and provide customer support to average
users who don't have technical skills. <br>
<br>
By analogy, people enthusiastically participate in yearly "spruce up
your block" projects, but nobody wants to sweep the streets on a
volunteer basis every day of every week of the year. At first it's
fun, then it becomes "good exercise," then it becomes boring, and
pretty quickly it's a pain in the butt and people start drifting
off. That's why we have union workers to operate sweeping machines:
it's a job that needs to be done reliably every day. <br>
<br>
And realistically, speaking from almost 30 years' experience in
installing, programming, and maintaining telephone systems for
hundreds of clients in the Bay Area, it really does get like
street-sweeping pretty quickly. It's work, un-glamorous and mostly
dull, even for someone who loves working with the technology. <br>
<br>
What's likely to happen, as the best way forward, is for folks to do
what inspires them and motivates them, and not get stuck exploiting
themselves via some kind of "sense of obligation." (How many
hackers really want to answer customer service calls?;-) There's
more than enough open ground for lots of community gardens to bloom
and bear fruit. <br>
<br>
This also opens up the potential for collaboration between CTel and
510pen and other groups and individuals. What a lot of
hackers/makers want, is not only to create cool stuff, but to see
their stuff released to the public and put into general use by
people. We can do that, and people can get paid for the stuff
they've developed. The inherent financial openness of the
cooperative business model means that those arrangements will occur
within the broader community consensus, to ensure everyone has a
fair and satisfactory outcome. <br>
<br>
At present we have an initial test-case and demo system that
interfaces with telephones and laptops, and we're working on a
routing protocol that will provide for truly integrated voice and
data addressing in the network. I've been wanting to bring the
stuff in and show it off; this is just a matter of finding a time
when the Wednesday evening meeting agenda isn't already full with
important items such as organizational structure (and when I'm not
busy with work for my clients, such as tonight).<br>
<br>
The next step will be to set up mesh voice communication between
local hackerspaces/makerspaces. For example a "red phone" hotline
between SudoRoom and Ace Monster Toys, and another link to
Techliminal, and then (more ambitiously, this may or may not work
depending on topography) to Noisebridge in SF. Along the way we can
pick up a few other SudoRoom members' households if they're in the
transmission path. <br>
<br>
I've been funding the R&D out of pocket, which has made things
go more slowly than otherwise, but that's better than getting money
with external strings attached. <br>
<br>
There's more to be said about all this, possibly at a meeting where
people can try out the demo system.<br>
<br>
Meanwhile I've got a stack of tasks to do tonight...<br>
<br>
-G.<br>
<br>
<br>
======<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13-03-27-Wed 9:07 AM, Romy Ilano
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:DA9F24F2-BBE5-4D84-8162-ECC47A005487@snowyla.com"
type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
charset=ISO-8859-1">
<div>G, a presentation on the "hidden history " of indie telco
networks would be really cool to me! </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Would it interest one of the public school history teachers? </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Then the 510 network people could show how the history is
relevant to what they're doing now. <br>
<br>
What do ya think of that? <br>
<div>---</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Romy Ilano</div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.snowyla.com">http://www.snowyla.com</a></div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:romy@snowyla.com">romy@snowyla.com</a></div>
</div>
<div><br>
On Mar 26, 2013, at 23:15, Anon195714 <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:anon195714@sbcglobal.net">anon195714@sbcglobal.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
<br>
Yep, and I could give an all-day presentation on the topic,
including the UK and Australia as well as the USA. <br>
<br>
The Bell System operated according to engineering standards
that called for design and installation details that were too
expensive to provide in rural areas without raising the price
of service to an unacceptable level. So the Bell stayed out
of those areas at first, and smaller independent telcos sprang
up to serve them.<br>
<br>
Farmers in some rural areas not served by Bell, set up
"telephone cooperatives" where they all bought in and paid for
the equipment, and chipped in labor or hired someone to go
about setting up the systems. The earliest implementations
ran their wires along the tops of the fences between farm
properties. <br>
<br>
Another story that's fairly well known: how the dial phone was
invented.<br>
<br>
Undertaker Almon Strowger noticed that he was losing business
to a competitor who had a relative working as an operator.
When someone said "operator, get me an undertaker," she'd put
them through to her relative. Strowger decided he'd had
enough of that, and set about inventing the Automatic
Telephone. In a way, you could consider Strowger to also be
the inventor of the concept of "net neutrality."<br>
<br>
This was the origin of the Strowger or (in Bell System lingo)
"Step-by-Step" switching system. These machines are a beauty
to behold as they go through their clever mechanical motions
to connect calls. I spent my teenage years in an area served
by a Strowger switch, and I had the chance to work on Strowger
PBXs a couple of times, as well as building some nifty stuff
from Strowger components. Most noticeable is the definite
sense of being in a distinct "place" in cyberspace, a unique
route through the machine, with subtle acoustical
characteristics that a trained tech (or a teenage phone
phreak) could recognize. <br>
<br>
Strowger switches served in the USA from about 1896 (the very
first one) to the late 1980s, and in the UK and Australia from
the late 1920s or so through the late 1980s. They were immune
to the electromagnetic pulse (EMP) created by atomic bombs.
And overnight when traffic was light, they used less power
than today's digital switches. <br>
<br>
There are oodles of stories to be told about Strowger. <br>
<br>
For one thing, "wiretaps" required physical connections to the
lines at the exchange. In the days when the GPO (General Post
Office) ran the telephones in the UK, GPO engineers were
tasked with showing military intelligence and law enforcement
where to find the correct places to make the connections. But
if they (the GPO engs.) decided that a particular wiretap was
political or otherwise an abuse of authority, they would wait
until the coast was clear and then just disconnect it. <br>
<br>
Today, with CALEA and Google Voice, we have no control over
who gets into the telephone switches via the back door, or who
intercepts calls from elsewhere in the network, and no way to
stop them. Some would call that "progress." <br>
<br>
Going back to WW2, resistance members in the telephone
engineering staffs in Nazi-occupied countries figured out a
clever way to "route around the damage" of Nazi
eavesdropping. I'll save that story for some possible future
presentation. <br>
<br>
I also have a working English uniselector dial system that
uses Strowger components, that I could bring in and
demonstrate at some point if anyone's interested. <br>
<br>
-G.<br>
<br>
<br>
=====<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13-03-26-Tue 10:24 PM, Romy
Ilano wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAFqWQB_K3GRu5Ch9uRTRRwmk23FMPz8zxMg4U+=JePohN9CPag@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">side note:
<div>did you know the history of telephone companies in
the usa? i was reading about it. (someone smart left a
book for me to read) =D</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> it's so fascinating. before the depression, it
wasn't profitable for major telecoms to go to rural
communities, especially in the midwest. they
disrespected the farmers and thought they were yokels...</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>so the midwest used to be pretty left wing too (and
the source of a lot of unrest with the farmers etc), so
there was this big tradition of DIY telephone and
telegraphs. someone gave me this history to read, it was
so neat! it's weird that nobody talks about this history
now. it's like it was forgotten! <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="">it's so weird how all these rabblerousers
and farmers from the midwest are totally buried. nobody
learns about it in us history, especially kids in
Kansas.</div>
<div style=""><br>
</div>
<div style=""> it reminds me of the indie network you are
constructing at 510</div>
<div style=""><br>
</div>
<div style=""><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 6:14 PM,
Anon195714 <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:anon195714@sbcglobal.net"
target="_blank">anon195714@sbcglobal.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <br>
<br>
Anthony, I know you didn't mean "no grids," but I
was concerned that a quick skim of this discussion
by anyone who didn't know the material in depth,
might lead to the wrong conclusions. <br>
<br>
For an example of the danger of over-centralization:<br>
<br>
Consider the conversion of the public switched
telephone network to VOIP, in light of the desire on
the part of telcos to reap a huge honking windfall
by selling off their vast real estate holdings.
AT&T owns about 5,000 central offices, at least
one in just about every medium or larger city in the
USA. Comcast has FIVE nationwide, and AT&T
would love to do likewise, and conversion to VOIP
will accomplish just that. <br>
<br>
I'm sure you know what it's called when you
centralize something by a factor of 1,000 to 1: <br>
<br>
"A high-value target." <br>
<br>
Something that's just begging to be hit hard and
taken out, by a crazed dictator or an international
terrorist group, or perhaps by a few sociopaths of
the same kind who run ID theft rings and bank-card
skimmer rings, or perhaps by someone out for the
sheer thrill of smashing and wrecking.<br>
<br>
The plans for the "smart power grid" will produce
more high-value targets: regional power control
systems, centrally managed, all internet-connected
and just daring the assholes of the world to hit
them.<br>
<br>
Already, smart meters provide a tasty treat for
predators. I'm aware of a couple of vulnerabilities
that haven't been published, that would enable a
single person with a grudge to black out a
neighborhood for a couple of days. This situation
will compound as smart meters, smart grids, and
stupid regulatory officials converge. <br>
<br>
All of this over-centralization, and over-reliance
on "smart" things, is causing our entire society to
crawl further and further out on a limb that becomes
more and more fragile every day. Sooner than later,
something will break, bigtime. <br>
<br>
In a very practical sense, we have to be concerned
with resilience. <br>
<br>
About which more in my next post.<br>
<br>
-G.<br>
<br>
<br>
=====
<div>
<div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 13-03-26-Tue 5:28 PM, Anthony Di Franco
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default">To be clear, I
don't mean to say "no grids!1!!1!!!" but
just "use large-scale grids only for what
they're best for in the context of a
broader heterogeneous system, not for
almost everything as they are now, and
take into account in a rigorous way
overall system efficiency and other
concerns like vulnerability to failures
both routine and rare and corruptibility
of the social systems that grow up around
the technical systems."</div>
<div class="gmail_default"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default">I remember
discussing these points a few times in the
past with you, George, and Hol, and others
around sudo room; might we like to get
some documentation together on interesting
specifics? A section of the wiki maybe,
where we can throw ideas up about the
details and see what sticks?</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Mar 26,
2013 at 5:06 PM, Anon195714 <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:anon195714@sbcglobal.net"
target="_blank">anon195714@sbcglobal.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <br>
<br>
A lot of the arguement against power
grids is ultimately rooted in
opposition to having our energy supply
controlled by distant corporations
whose decisions are not sustainable
and not in our interests. <br>
<br>
I agree that over-dependence on greedy
corporations for vital infrastructure,
merely for the sake of convenience, is
a shortcut to servitude. Google is
the worst offender, with its seductive
Gmail and Google Voice offering
"convenience" in exchange for
intensive and intrusive surveillance,
not only of those who use the
services, but of everyone they
communicate with. (Worst of all,
Google Glass: "become a volunteer
surveillance drone!")<br>
<br>
The model we should be looking toward,
to manage the power grid, is one of
municipally-owned transmission
infrastructure (the wires along the
streets), and diversification of power
producers (from individual households
to the existing power utilities).
Everyone would be paid the same rate
for power they "upload" to the grid,
and everyone would pay the same rate
for power they "download." This would
immediately level the playing field
and provide an enormous incentive for
all manner of renewable and new-tech
power generation. <br>
<br>
Further, the municipal ownership model
should also apply to the wired
telecoms grid: telephone and
internet. (Even your mobile device is
only "wireless" for the last half mile
at most; the rest of the way it's as
wired as my antique dial phones.) All
of these things are using the public
rights-of-way along the streets; they
are arguably public rights-of-way in
themselves, and as such, should be
owned by the public. <br>
<br>
The municipal internet of electricity
would entail each local power producer
(household or larger) having small
storage capacity on-site, and a
switching synchronized inverter to
connect to the grid. An onboard
microprocessor with an analog voltage
sensors would monitor line power to
determine when power should be
uploaded to the grid or downloaded
from the grid. Simple "net metering"
would keep track of the billing. <br>
<br>
The small decentralized battery packs
would act primarily as buffers, to
level out power production and
consumption among users. Overnight
and over multiple cloudy days, and
during peak demand hours, the
decentralized solar would be
supplemented by other power sources
such as micro-reactors and natural gas
turbines. <br>
<br>
The uniform pricing mechanism would
prevent predatory "arbitrage" of
electricity, and provide the incentive
to install solar panels on every
solar-accessible flat surface, even on
bus shelters and other street kiosks.
<br>
<br>
The point-of-production
microprocessors would be isolated from
the internet to prevent cyber-attacks
against the grid: the best kind of
"smart grid" is one that
self-regulates locally without being
vulnerable globally. <br>
<br>
I should also mention: Yes, electric
automobiles can provide household
power storage in the absence of having
a grid, but a) not everyone owns or
even wants an automobile, b) if you've
drained your car battery pack
overnight to power your house, it's
not available the next morning to get
you to work, and c) even if everyone
could afford a new electric car, there
are good reasons to reduce car
ownership and usage in favor of
bicycles, scooters, motorcycles,
buses, and trains. <br>
<br>
Beyond that, we should not be
destroying our civic infrastructure in
favor of requiring everyone to have
their own i-Things or do without.
Public phones, public bathrooms (do
you really want to carry an i-Pee
around?), public drinking fountains,
public benches for sitting, public
transport, etc.: are all civic goods
that make the public sphere more
user-friendly and accessible. A
public power grid is another example,
as with public water supply, public
sewage treatment, and refuse disposal:
life without those things would be
worse than miserable.<br>
<br>
Don't destroy it: reclaim it, revision
it, and rebuild it. <br>
<br>
-G.<br>
<br>
<br>
=====<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 13-03-26-Tue 3:41 PM, Anthony
Di Franco wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default">Production
of alternative energy can be and
for most reasons probably should
be much less centralized,
equivalently, smaller-scale,
than production of energy mostly
is now. (Off-grid, as you
mention, but very literally.)</div>
<div class="gmail_default">Large-scale
up front + large, complex
distribution networks is
revealed as an obsolete
architecture; large scale
distribution networks become
relatively less important, so
even if the answer to your
question is no, which it
probably isn't given
crowdfunding and other
disintermediated finance gaining
momentum, it's moot, or at least
of much less relative
importance.</div>
<div class="gmail_default">Put
another way, when the most
important goal is maximum
efficiency rather than maximum
centralization, large upfront
capital investment + large,
complex distribution network is
stupid; <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://homebrewindustrialrevolution.wordpress.com/"
target="_blank">proper
accounting</a> of all costs
and benefits in a global rather
than piecewise local sense
reveals this now for
agriculture, manufacturing,
energy, ...</div>
<div class="gmail_default">Even
now, buffering between supply
and demand is a constraint on
grid architecture leading to
great economic demand within the
current paradigm for distributed
storage / production of energy
according to someone who came
through sudo room whose name
escapes me.</div>
<div class="gmail_default">This
loosely-drafted email brought to
you by the <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2010/11/eaas-non-rival-goods-vs-rival-goods.html"
target="_blank">slogan</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.miiu.org/wiki/Resilient_Things_by_Top-Level_Category"
target="_blank">"localize
production, virtualize
everything else"</a> and the
acronym <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.accelerationwatch.com/mest.html"
target="_blank">STEMI</a> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2008/11/stemi.html"
target="_blank">compression</a>.</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue,
Mar 26, 2013 at 3:17 PM, Romy
Ilano <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:romy@snowyla.com"
target="_blank">romy@snowyla.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Is it possible
to create alternative energy
distribution networks
(biofuels/solar/ wind etc)
that replace mainstream
petrol and natural gas based
energy without a large
financial sector?
<div><br>
</div>
<div> the vc system that
funds these alternative
energy start-ups piggy
backs off the investment
banks, etc. and big
private equity and
institutional investment
funds. vcs are like a fly
on the @ss of a financial
hippo.</div>
<div> <br>
</div>
<div>I haven't heard people
discuss off-grid that much
in the tech talks I've
been to( which are
excellent). Is there a
conversation here that
would show how off grid is
a viable alternative, even
if it's not a big money
solution?<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On
Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at
1:56 PM, <span
dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:hol@gaskill.com" target="_blank">hol@gaskill.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote
class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">this
talk about imports
and exports always
reminds me of energy
flow<br>
<br>
compare 2011<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.llnl.gov/news/newsreleases/2012/Oct/images/25306_LLNLUSEnergy2011650.jpg"
target="_blank">https://www.llnl.gov/news/newsreleases/2012/Oct/images/25306_LLNLUSEnergy2011650.jpg</a><br>
<br>
<br>
with 2002<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.hubbertpeak.com/us/images/us_energyflow2002.jpg"
target="_blank">http://www.hubbertpeak.com/us/images/us_energyflow2002.jpg</a><br>
<br>
fascinating<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
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href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss"
target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
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</blockquote>
</div>
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