<div dir="ltr">I'm curious to hear more about your PSTN based addressing scheme, and how one could build a large distributed network with it.<div><br></div><div style>-steve</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 11, 2013 at 8:30 AM, GtwoG PublicOhOne <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:g2g-public01@att.net" target="_blank">g2g-public01@att.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">

  
    
  
  <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    <br>
    Re. Alcides:  Nope, haven't heard of CJ-DNS yet.  <br>
    <br>
    A lot of us are thinking along similar lines.  The internet as it
    now stands is thoroughly broken, an ecosystem dominated by predators
    and parasites of all kinds, from the obvious scum who engage in
    phishing attacks, botnets, and spam, to the less obvious types who
    do things like offer "free" candy in exchange for stalking us
    everywhere we go, whether we know it or not, and whether we like it
    or not (see also my item (8) below).  It's buggy, bloated, and
    broken, and it's overdue for a change.  <br>
    <br>
    I'm looking for someone who can write an IPV4/6 to decimal PSTN
    address conversion application, suitable for mesh.  Mesh by its
    nature requires using the address of the device as its routable
    destination.  This does not work for telephony beyond the level of
    small PBX at present, and will completely break in IPV6.  Using a
    centralized address server to manage transactions breaks the mesh
    paradigm.  Therefore the need for a new addressing system based on
    the PSTN (public switched telephone network).  The version I'm
    proposing will also give each address 10,000 extension addresses for
    any combination of voice and data devices.<br>
    <br>
    More about which later, as I've gotta scoot off to work right now;
    be back this evening.<br>
    <br>
    -G.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    =====<div><div class="h5"><br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div>On 13-06-11-Tue 7:54 AM, Alcides
      Gutierrez wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <p dir="ltr">G,</p>
      <p dir="ltr">Have you heard of cjdns? Do you have any thoughts on
        it? The ideal goal is to replace the Internet (current) with a
        new one. ProjectMeshnet.org</p>
      <p dir="ltr">Alcides Gutierrez<br>
        <a href="http://e64.us" target="_blank">http://e64.us</a></p>
      <div class="gmail_quote">On Jun 11, 2013 7:41 AM, "Andrew" <<a href="mailto:andrew@roshambomedia.com" target="_blank">andrew@roshambomedia.com</a>>
        wrote:<br type="attribution">
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
          <div dir="ltr">maybe sudoroom should run an email server that
            encrypts messages on the disk as well offers end to end
            encryption over the air.<br>
          </div>
          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
            <br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 11, 2013 at 4:07 AM,
              GtwoG PublicOhOne <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:g2g-public01@att.net" target="_blank">g2g-public01@att.net</a>></span>
              wrote:<br>
              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
                Hi Max, YOs-<br>
                <br>
                Speaking from more than casual knowledge of the subject
                matter, as a few<br>
                of us here know:<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                1) If you read the denials issued by Google and
                Facebook, you'll<br>
                discover that they used almost identical language. And
                while it's true<br>
                that corporate PR-speak and legal-speak are usually as
                bland as baked<br>
                beans, this stuff reminds one of the story where Mrs.
                Jones and Mrs.<br>
                Smith each had a baby that bears more than a slight
                resemblance to the<br>
                guy who delivers both of their newspapers:<br>
                <br>
                Google: "First, we have not joined any program that
                would give the U.S.<br>
                government—or any other government—direct access to our
                servers."<br>
                <br>
                Facebook: "Facebook is not and has never been part of
                any program to<br>
                give the US or any other government direct access to our
                servers."<br>
                <br>
                Google: "We had not heard of a program called PRISM
                until yesterday."<br>
                <br>
                Facebook: "We hadn't even heard of PRISM before
                yesterday."<br>
                <br>
                Google: "Our legal team reviews each and every
                request..."<br>
                <br>
                Facebook: "When governments ask Facebook for data, we
                review each<br>
                request carefully..."<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                2) Of course they didn't "join" a program or become
                "part of" a program.<br>
                NSA isn't a "club" that you can just "join." What
                Facebook and Google<br>
                did was become ASSETS of a program.<br>
                <br>
                That is a very subtle but important distinction. If you
                were to ask<br>
                their lawyers if they "had become assets or had acted in
                any capacity as<br>
                assets of any entity within the United States
                Intelligence Community<br>
                (USIC)," they would clam up right quick. One needs to
                know how to ask<br>
                the question in order to get at the answer.<br>
                <br>
                Also, it is the case that the assets of a program or
                operation rarely if<br>
                ever know the name of the program or operation involved.
                Knowing the<br>
                name of the program or op would give the assets the
                ability to compare<br>
                notes and possibly compromise the program or op. Very
                often, even the<br>
                names of programs or ops are themselves classified.<br>
                <br>
                By the way, some of y'all may have heard my comments
                about Steve Jobs'<br>
                application for a security clearance, shortly after Jobs
                died and his<br>
                bio was published. The media were preoccupied with the
                usual celebrity<br>
                gossip about how he could have gotten a clearance when
                he'd admitted to<br>
                taking LSD and building blue boxes (naughty phone-phreak
                devices). But<br>
                the real story, as I said at the time, was that the
                purpose of the<br>
                clearance was to facilitate relationships with certain
                agencies<br>
                regarding surveillance opportunities in the Macintosh
                operating systems<br>
                and other products. It is almost 100% certain that
                Microsoft and certain<br>
                of the commercial companies involved in Open Source
                operating systems,<br>
                had similar relationships. ("Intel Inside", anyone?;-)<br>
                <br>
                One more item. Watch for the names Cisco, Comcast, and
                Symantec, in the<br>
                news.<br>
                <br>
                Aww hell, one more after that. Twitter claims to have
                refused to<br>
                participate in PRISM. That's very convenient for them to
                say, because<br>
                Twitter itself is a complete intel collection platform
                with fully open<br>
                access, and a variety of software tools for analysis.
                Twitter is the<br>
                easiest of the bunch to intercept and fully exploit. You
                too can play at<br>
                that game (just a little but enough to get the flavor of
                it), if you<br>
                want to pay for the software.<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                3) Yes, NSA can monitor traffic without a carrier or
                service provider<br>
                knowing it. This is done by intercepting the traffic at
                the carrier<br>
                level. By analogy, if I want to tap your broadband
                service, I don't have<br>
                to break into your house to do it: I can do it from any
                point between<br>
                your house and the service provider's central office.<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                4) Telcos and broadband providers are required to have
                CALEA intercept<br>
                equipment (such as the infamous Naris box of EFF fame)
                installed in<br>
                their racks. This equipment enables authorized entities
                to siphon the<br>
                data streams in realtime, either in whole or in part
                depending on<br>
                various assigned levels of privilege.<br>
                <br>
                If everything that's on a server has gotten there via a
                connection that<br>
                is being intercepted constantly in real-time, there's no
                need to get<br>
                inside the server itself.<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                5) NSA and real-time decryption: There is reason to
                believe, based on<br>
                published accounts, that certain types of decryption are
                routine and<br>
                automated. I also know from unpublished but not
                classified sources, that<br>
                there are automated tests that examine ciphertext to
                determine<br>
                specifically which encryption method and key length were
                used to encrypt<br>
                the data. I would conclude that automated decryption
                exceeds the<br>
                capabilities that have been reported in the press.<br>
                <br>
                Further, I would strongly suggest that we compile
                versions of PGP and<br>
                GPG from source code, and modify them to eliminate the
                upper limit on<br>
                key sizes. I can explain further how to perform that
                modification of the<br>
                source code, once we have it downloaded. It's remarkably
                easy.<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                6) Compromise of private keys: Given the number of
                methods available,<br>
                and given the track records of the various entities
                involved, I would<br>
                not be surprised.<br>
                <br>
                "Mary had a private key, with which to open PGP.<br>
                The key fell into hostile hands. Now Mary's hiding, with
                her lambs."<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                7) Did Google and Facebook lie?<br>
                <br>
                Do bears shit in the woods?<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                8) A modest prediction, and y'all can file this under
                "he wasn't crazy<br>
                after all."<br>
                <br>
                I've been saying this stuff for a while now, but recent
                news makes it<br>
                more, uhh, "topical":<br>
                <br>
                The entire advertising-based model of internet services,
                with its<br>
                reliance on "free" services "supported" by advertising
                that "requires"<br>
                pervasive tracking of every user's every activities and
                whereabouts,<br>
                will be demonstrated to have been an enormous cover
                story of<br>
                convenience, for a degree of mass surveillance that far
                exceeds anything<br>
                has been reported thus far.<br>
                <br>
                The goal is to have 100% collection of all
                communications and location<br>
                data, online and face-to-face, every conversation as
                well as metadata,<br>
                to be permanently archived for retrieval and analysis at
                any later point<br>
                in time. (This has not yet been achieved, but they're
                working on it.)<br>
                The goal of that, in turn, is to enable making accurate
                predictions<br>
                about the activities and location of any person, at any
                point in the<br>
                future. What gets done with those accurate predictions
                is a matter of<br>
                discretionary policy by those who control the data.<br>
                <br>
                Orwell: "He who controls the past controls the future.
                He who controls<br>
                the future controls the present." Me: "Knowledge is
                power. When they<br>
                know all about you, and you know nothing about them, who
                has the power?"<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                9) Lastly, Max, you might especially appreciate this bit
                of history:<br>
                <br>
                In the 1970s, GCHQ was engaged in targeted surveillance
                of various<br>
                dissident groups in the UK. But since GPO Telephones'
                switching systems<br>
                were entirely electro-mechanical (Strowger switches),
                GCHQ had to depend<br>
                on the GPO engineers to execute every request by making
                physical<br>
                connections to the lines at the Central Offices.<br>
                <br>
                The GPO engineers' sympathies were often with the
                dissidents. So,<br>
                shortly after the GCHQ officers left, the GPO engineers
                would quietly go<br>
                about undoing the unwanted connections or otherwise
                rendering them<br>
                useless. Such are the advantages of electro-mechanical
                analog switching<br>
                systems, maintained by skilled workers, with a strong
                union, and strong<br>
                class consciousness.<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                Cheers-<br>
                <br>
                -G.<br>
                <br>
                "You search Google, and Google searches you. Deal?"<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                ======<br>
                <div>
                  <div><br>
                    <br>
                    <br>
                    On 13-06-10-Mon 11:46 PM, Max B wrote:<br>
                    > I have a quick question to throw out for anyone
                    with opinions:<br>
                    ><br>
                    > When the NSA PRISM program was exposed, it was
                    leaked that the NSA has<br>
                    > the capabilities to monitor the content of
                    communications taking place<br>
                    > through any of the list of companies they
                    mentioned. Then Google,<br>
                    > Apple, and crew came out and denied it.<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Would it be possible for the NSA to be
                    monitoring traffic without them<br>
                    > knowing it/allowing a backdoor? Would that
                    require NSA servers doing<br>
                    > 128-bit SSL decryption at real-time speeds? Or
                    perhaps only when<br>
                    > specific emails needed to be read? Could they
                    have covertly<br>
                    > compromised the private keys of all of these
                    establishments? ("US<br>
                    > Government hacked google" seems like a great
                    Guardian headline)<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Or do folks think that those companies are just
                    lying through their<br>
                    > teeth?<br>
                    ><br>
                    > On Mon 10 Jun 2013 10:43:42 PM PDT, Rabbit
                    wrote:<br>
                    >> Yes, let's have a end-user focused crypto
                    workshop!<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> I'm not an expert but I can help OS X users
                    get set up with<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> Tor<br>
                    >> Adium + OTR<br>
                    >> Making encrypted disk images<br>
                    >> Truecrypt<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> And I wanna learn about web of trust,
                    keysigning, gpg for email<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> Also I'm really wishing for a better social
                    network for people to<br>
                    >> switch to. Any thoughts on that?<br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >> On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 7:55 PM, GtwoG
                    PublicOhOne<br>
                    >> <<a href="mailto:g2g-public01@att.net" target="_blank">g2g-public01@att.net</a>
                    <mailto:<a href="mailto:g2g-public01@att.net" target="_blank">g2g-public01@att.net</a>>>
                    wrote:<br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >> YES! a crypto party.<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> PGP and GPG won't protect your metadata
                    from traffic analysis ("TA"),<br>
                    >> which is what's been revealed that Anagram
                    Inn has been up to. But<br>
                    >> protecting your content is a good start,
                    and building email<br>
                    >> servers that<br>
                    >> are end-to-end encrypted is the next step.<br>
                    >><br>
                    >> -G.<br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >> =====<br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >> On 13-06-10-Mon 7:13 PM, William Budington
                    wrote:<br>
                    >> > There was some discussion about this
                    at the last meeting, mostly<br>
                    >> around<br>
                    >> > securing personal data on physical
                    devices, but it would be good<br>
                    >> to have<br>
                    >> > another end-user based cryptoparty,
                    even have it be a full-day event<br>
                    >> > stemming from Today I Learned. I'll
                    bring this up at the meeting on<br>
                    >> > Wednesday.<br>
                    >> ><br>
                    >> > Bill<br>
                    >> ><br>
                    >> > On 06/10/2013 07:02 PM, William Gillis
                    wrote:<br>
                    >> >> Hey Sudoroomers,<br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >> I've been deluged by friends this
                    weekend suddenly interested<br>
                    >> in things<br>
                    >> >> like finally figuring out how to
                    install that there tor, or god<br>
                    >> forbid<br>
                    >> >> venturing into the realm of pgp. I
                    offered my nonstop 1:1<br>
                    >> handholding<br>
                    >> >> services over facebook to any and
                    all friends and have been a<br>
                    >> little<br>
                    >> >> overwhelmed by the number.<br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >> Someone local suggested a teach
                    day at Sudoroom and I thought<br>
                    >> I'd check to<br>
                    >> >> see if anyone else is interested
                    and, you know, what actual<br>
                    >> members have to<br>
                    >> >> say.<br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >> There has never been a more
                    opportune moment for cryptoparty<br>
                    >> outreach, and<br>
                    >> >> yet I haven't seen anyone declare
                    anything yet. Am I just out<br>
                    >> of the loop?<br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >>
                    _______________________________________________<br>
                    >> >> sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    >> >> <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    >> <mailto:<a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a>><br>
                    >> >> <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                    >> >><br>
                    >> >
                    _______________________________________________<br>
                    >> > sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    >> > <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    >> <mailto:<a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a>><br>
                    >> > <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                    >> ><br>
                    >><br>
                    >>
                    _______________________________________________<br>
                    >> sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    >> <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    >> <mailto:<a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a>><br>
                    >> <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >><br>
                    >>
                    _______________________________________________<br>
                    >> sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    >> <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    >> <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                    > _______________________________________________<br>
                    > sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    > <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    > <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                    ><br>
                    <br>
                    _______________________________________________<br>
                    sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
                    <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
                    <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </blockquote>
            </div>
            <br>
            <br clear="all">
            <br>
            -- <br>
            -------
            <div>Andrew Lowe</div>
            <div>Cell: <a href="tel:831-332-2507" value="+18313322507" target="_blank">831-332-2507</a></div>
            <div><a href="http://roshambomedia.com" target="_blank">http://roshambomedia.com</a></div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
          </div>
          <br>
          _______________________________________________<br>
          sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
          <a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org" target="_blank">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
          <a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
          <br>
        </blockquote>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </div></div></div>

<br>_______________________________________________<br>
sudo-discuss mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org">sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>-steve
</div>