Ryan, why do you think I identify with or consider appropriate as applied to me the term "cis man"?  I don't.  Please don't direct it toward me or use it to refer to me again.  TIA.  Otherwise, my effort to be helpful and constructive having crashed and burned, I'm done with this discussion.

-- Steve

On Sun, Feb 8, 2015 at 11:44 AM, Mary Ward <maryhbw@gmail.com> wrote:

The point is that this conversation has become destructive. I do not think pointing out people in the discuss list if helpful, only hurtful. The CDC list may be a better place for in depth conversations about bans.

Sincerely,

Mary
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 8, 2015, at 11:33 AM, Ryan <yandoryn@gmail.com> wrote:

TBC I don't need a cis man telling me how I should proceed after I was sexually assaulted.

TBC I don't need a cis man euphemizing a sexual predator's behavior.

TBC I don't need a cis man "researching" the situation to see if there were more incidents.

TBC I don't need a cis man adding to the tone policing in this thread.

TBC you are mansplaining right now Steve, and that's the last fucking thing I need right now.

On Sun, Feb 8, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Steve Bloom <stevebloom55@gmail.com> wrote:

TBC, yar, your statement necessarily had implications for what Al said.  It could have been phrased to not do that even while still expressing support for Ryan.  Korl can think it was unconstructive without taking it personally.  I don't think the subsequent statement that Korl has something to learn here was helpful.

That said, let's not lose track of the fact that Perry has serious loss-of-boundary issues when he drinks (which seems to be frequently).  My own experience (two experiences actually) is that he doesn't single people out for that (I got it too), but it's absolutely the case that the same behavior that was non-threatening for me will be very threatening for others.  (Something I need to bear in mind going foward; probably I should have asked if there have been other such incidents.)

I'm a little murky on the process here.  I mean, this open discussion isn't going to be used for some sort of vote, right?

Assuming this from David K. is correct --

"Yes, any member (but not guest) is empowered to temporarily ban - pending conflict mediation - anyone else so following a safe space violation which is what this is."

-- then it seems that all Ryan has to do is say that Perry is banned, following which a conflict mediation process is initiated.  If Ryan didn't feel that his and (as related) Ribre's particular experience was sufficient and so was asking others, then what Jenny and I added (and David K., although he didn't provide details of the incidents) seems like more than enough.

Returning to Ryan's original comment --

"Regardless, I ask that Perry be banned from the Omni, pending mediation, as his actions clearly violate our safe space policy and he refused to take action to alter his behaviour."

-- it seems to me that maybe it not being phrased as a statement may have engendered confusion.  So maybe just do that, Ryan?  TBC, apparently you don't need to ask anyone, and as noted if what you wanted was corroboration you have plenty.

As for the policy discussion, if Al or anyone wants to pursue that I suggest they do it in a different thread.   

Thanks to all.

-- Steve

 

On Sun, Feb 8, 2015 at 8:12 AM, yar <yardenack@gmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, Feb 8, 2015 at 1:06 AM, Soenke <soenkeveirls@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok.
> For the record...
> If this is how you all are going to conduct ourselves, and treat each other,
> I don't really want to be a part of it anymore.
> This is absurd.
> I thought we were trying to be better people here.
> But I suppose I was wrong.
>
> Extremely sarcastically, I apologize for speaking up.
>
> Have a good weekend everyone.

Hey Korl, with nothing but respect, I was just trying to express
solidarity with Ryan without making it about you. To me this is about
having a safe space where people aren't assaulted or misgendered.
There is nothing personal against you here. I hope you can learn to
see that.

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