Difference between revisions of "Mesh/11 December 2018"

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== Action  
== Action Items ==
* apply to APC
* apply to APC
* follow up with all power labs - scott
* follow up with all power labs - scott

Revision as of 16:47, 17 December 2018

Ice-breaker for next meeting: Which firefox extensions do you use (and why)?

People's Open Network Weekly Meeting - 11 December 2018 7:30pm-9pm


  • Introductions and Meeting Roles (10 mins)
  • Check in on previous action items (5 mins)
  • Updates & Reportbacks (20 mins)
  • Next Sunday (5 mins)
  • Discussion: Oakland Comms Choice Language (15 mins)
  • Action Items (5 mins)
  • Breakout Groups


Introduce yourself: Name; Preferred Pronoun; Icebreaker Response; BRIEF Announcements

  • Icebreaker question:
  • Eve - she - DuckDuckGo privacy extensions
  • Benny - he - AdBlocker, TreeStyleTabs or sthg?
  • Scott - he - AdBlocker
  • seth - he/they-cookies autodelete
  • Gautam - he - Privacy Badger
  • Steven - he - Tabs Suspender
  • robb - he - AdBlock, NoScript, HTTPS
  • jenny - she/her - AdBlock, NoScript, HTTPS, lastpass, zotero
  • marc - he - put question as trying to make browser less trackable. had too many extensions. . Privacy Possum, written by a sudomesher
  • yar - she - not to be a downer but adding privacy extensions actually makes you more trackable bc of your fingerprint, better is to integrat these upstream into firefox. could run tor, but actually tbh running internet explorer in a win10 VM might be your best route
  • jehan - he - adblock. tried Brave, but isn't my default for reasons
  • lesley - wtvr she/they - adblock+, ..block origin
  • doyouhaveamirror - we/us - adblock+
  • mai-remote - she/they - privacy badger, httpseverywhere, treestyletabs (great for tabs addicts...)
  • null-remote - he/him - tree-style tabs ublock origin
  • blake - n/a - wrote privacypossum, have a job now so havent worked on it so much

Meeting Roles

Check in on previous action items

Check previous meeting minutes at https://sudoroom.org/wiki/Mesh/Minutes and past action items below:

  • ewaste pickup (breakout session after meeting)
  • jehan on insurance stuff: he and ben worked on this a few weeks ago. if we have exposure we dont tell them about (eg going on roofs) can make us default lost our policy. think we have to state we go on roofs. Was going to follow up with NCIA and see how we can characterize it and what that would do to the price of insurance. Also, are there possibilities like having people sign waivers?
    • if it's extremely expensive need to decide if it's worth the risk
    • Scott - officers could be disallowed from going on roofs
    • Jenny - other option is spin up LLC that does installations specifically
  • put proposal to fund participation in Nonprofit Democracy Network Gathering (mai)
    • mai: decided to hold off on putting this proposal on Loomio bc I needed to apply and I don't even know yet if we'll be accepted (and therefore have to pay). Also for expenditures < $2000 that can go to the Accounting WG anyway.
  • review project proposal process (next week) - all
  • schedule holiday party (maybe the 15th? - Loomio? could someone take this on?
    • jnny: ballroom is utterly free w/ no pending requests for the 14th, free after 2pm the 15th, free until 430pm Sunday the 16th (4:30pm setup for Liberated Lens' "Best of the [Film] Fest" event - +100 solidarity <3
    • seth: thought mai said we should all go to avenue after the mtg tonite
    • Scott - I'd be willing to throw a party on the 21st
**Null - i disagreed but did not block. - have my notes and Nico's response here: https://peoplesopen.net/pad/p/apc  sorry i 'm not at the meeting for this. 
*** jnny: ohh word

  • paxio link update
  • Marc - we heard back from Matt, asked when, and he hasn't replied yet. Another thing to follow up on is Place for Sustainable living or nearby, we'd get either a 1 gig or 10 gig link, which would be perfect. Only issue is that some people there who are concerned about radiation
    • Scott - All Power Labs is only a block or so from there too. We could get a link to Paxio and Archive on the same power. I could follow up with them.
    • Marc - when I ping paxio again I'll say we might be trying to work with All Power Labs
    • Scott - but do we even need the Paxio link if we have All Power?
    • Jenny - Sure! Feed the network!
    • Marc - There's no way without paying a ton of money that we'll get more than half a gigabit from the archive - unless we get a ton of garden hose and roll out the ethernet cable in the bay (this is a joke)
  • Jenny - Marina folks are down for potentially a tower at the marina (Berkeley Marina)
    • Robb - run down sailboat with a tall mast?
      • check on google earth LOS ~40ft above ground @ marina -> richmond tower

Updates & Reportbacks


Priority bugs we need help with are located at: http://peoplesopen.net/helpwanted - For a high-level overview of recent Github activity, see the Trello: https://trello.com/invite/b/r9l5ouQ4/3b2eecd83bb9e7a57a339cf1ee038288/sudo-mesh-github-repos

  • Exit server at hurricane electric is down
  • might have disabled option that enables it to boot if RAID is degraded
    • jehan - something wrong with James' cabinet and not the server?
    • Marc - no, we need someone to go down there with a monitor and see what's going on. If someone can give me a ride to day or tomorrow I could do it
    • Eve - I could do it.
  • Jenny - our psychz invoice is overdue to connect
    • Marc - we should write a guide
    • Jenny - there's Jorrit's guide
    • Blake - that doesn't go into RAID stuff.

Node Mounts & Outreach

Node Mounts Trello: https://trello.com/invite/b/DtzngKaM/49e1c21fc9da199fcdeceb8623b5117a/node-mounts

Communications & Events

Comms Trello: https://trello.com/invite/b/f3ugMPNU/94033ee6c2cef93fc1b1637b727c902a/sudo-mesh-communications // Events Trello: https://trello.com/invite/b/Y3XfDK85/2b6fcb4fa92788609692a53a96fb4614/peoples-open-events

Internal Logistics / Finance

Internal Logistics & Bureaucracy Trello: https://trello.com/invite/b/LzVQlW3X/1bb8bd543c8633688175365d2554c2c2/internal-logistics-bureaucracy-brainstorms

  • see insurance discussion above

Next Sunday

We host office hours every Sunday from 1-3pm in Sudo Room, and often arrange a rooftop node mount.

Discussion: Oakland Comms Choice language

  • https://www.loomio.org/d/T71fkVp8/language-for-oakland-ordinance-on-isp-choice
  • We MUST get back to Tracy about this by tonight (end of this meeting). If we don't, I will just tell her to go ahead with what they have since we can't come to a decision...!
  • The discussion was continued by juul, eenblam, mai, and null at office hours and notes were taken here: https://peoplesopen.net/pad/p/commschoice
  • Also see Jehan's comment re: "facilities-based provider"
  • mai: To answer Benny's question in Loomio -- "what does the ordinance do? Does it give legal power to individuals to select a "communications service provider" (and part of the point of the ordnance is to define who counts as a "communications service provider")? Does it give legal permission to an org that matches these criteria to install hardware on buildings?
    • mai: Yes. All it's about is giving tenants choice when it comes to their comms provider. The point of making these definitions more inclusive of projects like PON is to ensure that we somehow may not be excluded by some narrow definition. And yes, presumably if this ordinance passes it gives legal permission to orgs to install hardware on buildings
  • Marc - it says "or" subscriber-owned cooperative
    • Jenny - 'cooperative' is a term that's still being legally defined. Not necessarily a nonprofit, might have more stringent requirements
    • Marc - we could do member-owned cooperative where all subscribers are members. The idea is to only let in networks where people own their own infrastructure
    • Jehan - the rest of the law has language about who is an ISP, so a centralized entity is already covered. Someone centralized would already have an easier time applying for a lot of stuff. This law is leaving things open for centralized entities. If someone knows how to set up a wireless link and wasn't associated with us set up a mesh link, and the landlord was like 'no, we use AT&T' --then to be able to tell the landlord no, they'd have to set up a nonprofit
      • benny: could we say "?..."
    • jenny: actually did find an example of "resident, subscriber-owned cooperative https://www.keepbtlocal.com/local-board-local-views/
    • benny: do people feel strongly about not-for-profit and subscriber-owned qualification? We could provide a suggestion and then provide an alternative.
    • Blake: are we trying to write this law?
      • Jenny: a part of it. It's mainly the EFF and Media Alliance.
  • mai: all we're trying to help EFF and Media Alliance do is to give them a definition that will make room for us and projects like ours in the future have an easy time of getting permission (or not even having to ask permission) to install hardware on buildings. We should really just stick to the most simply thing possible and be as close to what Tracy suggested. They were being friendly to us by asking for our advice, and we just need to give them ~something~ that we're ~nominally~ okay with. This isn't meant to define who we are or constrain anyone. It's to leave room open for others and suggest a flexible definition.


  • local or internet-connected communications operator, including peer-to-peer
  • consider describing provider as "includes a California not-for-profit organization or subscriber-owned cooperative offering..."
    • mai: so the suggestion is to remove "community-operated"? I'm good with that. Thanks for taking the time everyone!
    • benny: suggestion is "internet-connected" -> "local or internet-connected" and "A California not-for-profit corporation" -> "A California not-for-profit corporation or subscriber-owned cooperative". Final wording people liked is here:
      • Community-operated local or internet-connected communications infrastructure, including peer-to-peer networks.
      • A California not-for-profit corporation or subscriber-owned cooperative offering local or internet-connected communications network infrastructure within the City of Oakland.

Discussion with Gautam

  • live in Clayton, east of Walnut Creek and would love to start a network there that might one day connect with you - but that's 25 miles and Mt Diablo in the way
  • live on a hill. town has a deal with Comcast
  • getting a mynet 750 for xmas

Discussion: Review Project Proposal Process


Action Items

  • apply to APC
  • follow up with all power labs - scott
  • upload marina photos - jenny
  • fix hurricane electric server - marc/robb - eve & yar (thurs) also available)
    • contact james for permission (jehan has contact) -
  • take office hours off the calendar for next few weeks - jenny
  • buy more WD mynet routers - marc/jenny - ** Null - we currently have 7 (Tl-wdr4300 n750) in inventory and 1 is broken. [Never Mind i think these are different] then what i saw in inventory

Breakout Groups

At the end of the meeting, break out into small groups to hack on or discuss specific topics.

Last Meeting Notes

End of Meeting