[sudo-discuss] sudo-discuss Digest, Vol 4, Issue 208

[J.D. Zamfirescu]

Agreed with Matt. As TOOOL says, understanding how locks work (and what
their vulnerabilities are) helps everyone make  smarter decisions about
physical security.

Might be worth mentioning that very few burglaries involve picked locks;
it's too easy to throw a brick through a window instead.

Also, for the record, the workshop is full at 20 participants.

J.D.


On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 12:58 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hey Cyrus,
>
> I think putting lock-picking in a larger context (up to globally) will
> help folks understand that this is a helpful and inquisitive practice that,
> for instance, helps improve security through experience and knowledge of
> security systems like locks. This statement is obvious to the security /
> hacker community, but not obvious to many others. For me personally, when I
> was living in a student cooperative, I needed to unlock a filing cabinet I
> bought used that came without a key. I watched a Youtube video of a
> 14-year-old who showed me how to do it with (I believe something like) an
> aluminum can and a paperclip. That was very helpful, and also exposed me to
> the reality that simple locks provide a nominal layer of security (just
> pulling open), but almost always have available exploits. I wouldn't put
> things I wanted to keep completely secure in that filing cabinet--but I
> would put things I didn't want to easily walk away.
>
> That being said, it is also important to note that this is one (I believe
> ~30 people, sold out) of many workshops to be held over the weekend in
> Oakland for http://workshopweekend.net/, and one of many events that
> happen at sudo room. Sudo-hosted events range from coding meetups
> http://www.meetup.com/EBJavaScript/ and informal learning sessions
> http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Today_I_Learned to local community organizing
> http://communitydemocracyproject.org/ and nerds who care about the
> environment http://nerdsfornature.org/. See more on our calendar
> http://sudoroom.org/calendar/ and come down this Friday during Art
> Murmur.
>
> // Matt
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 12:33 PM, Cyrus Farivar <cfarivar at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>>  FWIW—I'm in the process right now of writing up a short brief on
>> the whole thing for Ars Technica, and am pointing out how lock picking has
>> long been a part of hacker culture. If you have a statement, I can
>> include/add it.
>>
>> -C
>>
>> --
>> Cyrus Farivar
>> "suh-ROOS FAR-ih-var"
>>
>> Journalist and radio producer | cyrusfarivar.com
>> Author, "The Internet of Elsewhere" | internetofelsewhere.com
>> US: +1 510 394 5485 (m) | Twitter/Skype: cfarivar
>> "Being a good writer is 3% talent, 97% not being distracted by the
>> Internet."
>> cfarivar at cfarivar.org
>>
>> On Thursday, February 28, 2013 at 12:31 PM,
>> sudo-discuss-request at lists.sudoroom.org wrote:
>>
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>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (Eddan Katz)
>> 2. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (Eddan Katz)
>> 3. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (Anon195714)
>> 4. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (Eddan Katz)
>>  5. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (Shawn Lesniak)
>> 6. Re: FUD around Lockpicking class (mark burdett)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 10:22:20 -0800
>> From: Eddan Katz <eddan at clear.net>
>> To: sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID: <512FA05C.7070407 at clear.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"
>>
>> It would be worth our while for someone to draft a short statement that
>> can be posted on the Workshop Weekend website or as a Sudo Room blog
>> post. I'd be willing to help if someone did a first draft. So lame of
>> Jean Quan to not even look into it.
>>
>> In sum, I think there are two major elements to committing a crime - the
>> act itself and the intent. In order to have both, you need knowledge.
>> There's nothing in here about the socially positive reasons why you'd
>> want to teach that. Take the common experience everyone can relate to of
>> locking yourself out of your house, car, office, etc.. People need to
>> know how to pick locks most certainly in circumstances that are
>> authorized and often in the case of an emergency. We may want to clarify
>> that in regards to intent - we have the opposite motivation to teach
>> people these skills. It will go a long way to explicitly say that we by
>> no means condone the use of those skills for criminal purposes.
>>
>> We should post it and send it directly to the authors of the articles
>> before the end of the day, so that a further story can be written about
>> it. May also want to notify Susan Mernit @ Oakland Local to get a little
>> more fair and balanced reporting.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/27/13 11:20 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu wrote:
>>
>> more:
>>
>>
>> http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_22683660/oakland-mayor-jean-quan-apologizes-promoting-lock-picking
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com
>> <mailto:mattsenate at gmail.com <mattsenate at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>
>> It's awesome, free press!
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:40 PM, rusty lindgren
>> <rustylindgren at gmail.com <mailto:rustylindgren at gmail.com<rustylindgren at gmail.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Oh dear gawd. This is possibly the most moronic piece of
>> "journalism" I have ever seen.
>>
>> Are they unaware of the fact that you can go to a lock-picking
>>  school(actually it teaches you way more), and that this is
>> just a cheaper version of that? (see:
>> http://www.lock411.com/training.html).
>>
>> Also, virtually no crime in Oakland involves skilled
>> lock-picking, because it's a waste of time.
>>
>> Don't worry though, you can train in deadly martial arts, go
>>  to the shooting range, and buy ninja swords just about
>> anywhere in Oakland, but picking a Masterlock is "appalling".
>>
>> -Rusty
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Anca Mosoiu
>> <anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> Heads up. Looks like some folks aren't too happy that
>> people are learning how to pick locks this weekend.
>>
>> http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=9010047
>>
>>  Here is Oakland Local's response:
>>
>>
>> http://m.oaklandlocal.com/article/oaklands-mayor-quan-apologizes-mentioning-weekend-lockpicking-class-really
>>
>> Anca
>>
>>
>> --
>> -=-=-=-
>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>> anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>
>>  M: (510) 220-6660 <tel:%28510%29%20220-6660>
>> http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F:
>>  facebook.com/techliminal <http://facebook.com/techliminal>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rusty Lindgren
>> **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
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>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> >
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 10:35:48 -0800
>> From: Eddan Katz <eddan at clear.net>
>> To: sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID: <512FA384.6050105 at clear.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"
>>
>> Chicago Lock v. Fanberg is the case I was telling you about last night,
>> J.D. - http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=17605115413487325945.
>> Author of lock-picking manuals gets sued by the manufacturer of the
>> locks. Chicago Lock loses on its trade secret misappropriation claim.
>> Here's an excerpt from the facts of the case -
>>
>> Appellant Victor Fanberg, the son of locksmith Morris Fanberg and a
>> locksmith in his own right, has published a number of locksmith
>> manuals for conventional locks. Realizing that no compilation had
>>  been made of tubular lock key codes, in 1975 Fanberg advertised in a
>> locksmith journal,/Locksmith Ledger,/requesting that individual
>> locksmiths transmit to him serial number-key code correlations in
>>  their possession in exchange for a copy of a complete compilation
>> when finished. A number of locksmiths complied, and in late 1976
>> Fanberg and his father began to sell a two-volume publication of
>>  tubular lock codes, including those of Ace locks, entitled
>> "A-Advanced Locksmith's Tubular Lock Codes." In 1976 and 1977
>> Fanberg advertised in the manuals in the/Locksmith Ledger/for $49.95
>>  and indicated that it would be supplemented as new correlations
>> became known./See/Excerpt at 95-98. About 350 manuals had been sold
>> at the time of trial. The District Court found that Fanberg "had
>>  lost or surrendered control over persons who could purchase the
>> books,"/id./at 98, meaning that nonlocksmiths could acquire the code
>> manuals.
>>
>> The books contain correlations which would allow a person equipped
>>  with a tubular key grinding machine to make duplicate keys for any
>> listed Ace lock if the serial number of the lock was known. On some
>> models, the serial numbers appear on the exterior of the lock face.
>>  Thus, Fanberg's manuals would make it considerably easier4*403(and
>> less expensive) for a person to obtain (legitimately or
>> illegitimately) duplicate keys to Ace locks without going through
>>  the Company's screening process. This is what caused consternation
>> to the Company and some of its customers. At no time did Fanberg
>> seek, or the Company grant, permission to compile and sell the key
>>  codes. Nor did the individual locksmiths seek authorization from the
>> Company or their customers before transmitting their key code data
>> to Fanberg.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/27/13 11:20 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu wrote:
>>
>> more:
>>
>>
>> http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_22683660/oakland-mayor-jean-quan-apologizes-promoting-lock-picking
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com
>> <mailto:mattsenate at gmail.com <mattsenate at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>
>> It's awesome, free press!
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:40 PM, rusty lindgren
>> <rustylindgren at gmail.com <mailto:rustylindgren at gmail.com<rustylindgren at gmail.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Oh dear gawd. This is possibly the most moronic piece of
>> "journalism" I have ever seen.
>>
>> Are they unaware of the fact that you can go to a lock-picking
>>  school(actually it teaches you way more), and that this is
>> just a cheaper version of that? (see:
>> http://www.lock411.com/training.html).
>>
>> Also, virtually no crime in Oakland involves skilled
>> lock-picking, because it's a waste of time.
>>
>> Don't worry though, you can train in deadly martial arts, go
>>  to the shooting range, and buy ninja swords just about
>> anywhere in Oakland, but picking a Masterlock is "appalling".
>>
>> -Rusty
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Anca Mosoiu
>> <anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> Heads up. Looks like some folks aren't too happy that
>> people are learning how to pick locks this weekend.
>>
>> http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=9010047
>>
>>  Here is Oakland Local's response:
>>
>>
>> http://m.oaklandlocal.com/article/oaklands-mayor-quan-apologizes-mentioning-weekend-lockpicking-class-really
>>
>> Anca
>>
>>
>> --
>> -=-=-=-
>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>> anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>
>>  M: (510) 220-6660 <tel:%28510%29%20220-6660>
>> http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F:
>>  facebook.com/techliminal <http://facebook.com/techliminal>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rusty Lindgren
>> **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:06:24 -0800
>> From: Anon195714 <anon195714 at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: Eddan Katz <eddan at clear.net>
>> Cc: sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID: <512FAAB0.7030205 at sbcglobal.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>>
>> Hi Eddan-
>>
>> So was Ace asserting some kind of copyright or other IP control over the
>> correlations between the key codes and the locks? That's funny: like
>> copyrighting the names & numbers in the phone book;-)
>>
>> What kind of lawful right would Ace have had to control those codes? I
>> don't see any.
>>
>> Classic case of "security by obscurity" in the face of the data being
>> openly available to anyone who just looks. That plus Ace not having
>> adequate steps in place to verify the identity of people asking for
>> duplicate keys ("security by laziness";-). (As if any burglar is going
>> to order keys and wait a week to get them, when smashing a window
>> provides instant gratification?)
>>
>> Meanwhile, it's since been demonstrated that Ace locks and other tubular
>> locks of same size, are tremendously easy to pick with a tool anyone can
>> make from a Bic pen housing.
>>
>> To my mind the main value of learning to pick locks is to become more
>> aware of one's own security environment: particularly the degree to
>> which we very often depend on crappy locks, and then, with the
>> newly-acquired situational awareness about locks, the degree to which we
>> very often leave open all manner of other security holes in our physical
>> surroundings. Nothing says "replace your front door lock now!" like
>> being able to pick it with two paper clips in less than a minute. And
>> then you look at the big window right next to the front door... and the
>> un-shredded bills you put in the recycle bin with your name & account
>> numbers all over them... and the valuables in the back seat of your
>> car... etc.
>>
>> Next is the ability to get into places one has auth to be in: such as
>> when one locks oneself out of one's own house or car (or in my case, PBX
>> room on client site after hours, blush...).
>>
>> Equally is the ability to do likewise for friends (have done that a
>> handful of times).
>>
>> And from that, the generalization to our entire subculture, of the
>> degree of security awareness we should have all the time.
>>
>> Picking locks is like being able to disassemble, clean, and reassemble a
>> firearm: that skill does not make a law-abiding person start
>> contemplating committing murders. But it might make one start to think
>> more about personal safety on the streets at night.
>>
>> Lastly, I'll fess up to something. I think it's cool as hell when
>> people who ordinarily hack around with software, start hacking around
>> with _mechanical_ stuff. I'm bigtime in favor of people learning how to
>> hack around with _mechanical_ stuff. "Physical layer" as new
>> playground. To this list add your home appliances (the ones with motors
>> in 'em) and rotary dial phones, but that's another topic for another day.
>>
>> TTYs-
>>
>> -G.
>>
>>
>> =====
>>
>>
>> On 13-02-28-Thu 10:35 AM, Eddan Katz wrote:
>>
>> Chicago Lock v. Fanberg is the case I was telling you about last
>> night, J.D. -
>> http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=17605115413487325945.
>> Author of lock-picking manuals gets sued by the manufacturer of the
>> locks. Chicago Lock loses on its trade secret misappropriation claim.
>> Here's an excerpt from the facts of the case -
>>
>> Appellant Victor Fanberg, the son of locksmith Morris Fanberg and
>> a locksmith in his own right, has published a number of locksmith
>> manuals for conventional locks. Realizing that no compilation had
>>  been made of tubular lock key codes, in 1975 Fanberg advertised in
>> a locksmith journal, /Locksmith Ledger,/ requesting that
>> individual locksmiths transmit to him serial number-key code
>>  correlations in their possession in exchange for a copy of a
>> complete compilation when finished. A number of locksmiths
>> complied, and in late 1976 Fanberg and his father began to sell a
>>  two-volume publication of tubular lock codes, including those of
>> Ace locks, entitled "A-Advanced Locksmith's Tubular Lock Codes."
>> In 1976 and 1977 Fanberg advertised in the manuals in
>>  the /Locksmith Ledger/ for $49.95 and indicated that it would be
>> supplemented as new correlations became known. /See/ Excerpt at
>> 95-98. About 350 manuals had been sold at the time of trial. The
>>  District Court found that Fanberg "had lost or surrendered control
>> over persons who could purchase the books," /id./ at 98, meaning
>> that nonlocksmiths could acquire the code manuals.
>>
>> The books contain correlations which would allow a person equipped
>> with a tubular key grinding machine to make duplicate keys for any
>> listed Ace lock if the serial number of the lock was known. On
>>  some models, the serial numbers appear on the exterior of the lock
>> face. Thus, Fanberg's manuals would make it considerably
>> easier4*403 (and less expensive) for a person to obtain
>>  (legitimately or illegitimately) duplicate keys to Ace locks
>> without going through the Company's screening process. This is
>> what caused consternation to the Company and some of its
>>  customers. At no time did Fanberg seek, or the Company grant,
>> permission to compile and sell the key codes. Nor did the
>> individual locksmiths seek authorization from the Company or their
>>  customers before transmitting their key code data to Fanberg.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/27/13 11:20 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu wrote:
>>
>> more:
>>
>>
>> http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_22683660/oakland-mayor-jean-quan-apologizes-promoting-lock-picking
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Matthew Senate
>> <mattsenate at gmail.com <mailto:mattsenate at gmail.com <mattsenate at gmail.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> It's awesome, free press!
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:40 PM, rusty lindgren
>> <rustylindgren at gmail.com <mailto:rustylindgren at gmail.com<rustylindgren at gmail.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Oh dear gawd. This is possibly the most moronic piece of
>> "journalism" I have ever seen.
>>
>> Are they unaware of the fact that you can go to a
>>  lock-picking school(actually it teaches you way more), and
>> that this is just a cheaper version of that? (see:
>> http://www.lock411.com/training.html).
>>
>> Also, virtually no crime in Oakland involves skilled
>> lock-picking, because it's a waste of time.
>>
>> Don't worry though, you can train in deadly martial arts, go
>>  to the shooting range, and buy ninja swords just about
>> anywhere in Oakland, but picking a Masterlock is "appalling".
>>
>> -Rusty
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Anca Mosoiu
>> <anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> Heads up. Looks like some folks aren't too happy that
>> people are learning how to pick locks this weekend.
>>
>> http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=9010047
>>
>>  Here is Oakland Local's response:
>>
>>
>> http://m.oaklandlocal.com/article/oaklands-mayor-quan-apologizes-mentioning-weekend-lockpicking-class-really
>>
>> Anca
>>
>>
>> --
>> -=-=-=-
>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>> anca at techliminal.com <mailto:anca at techliminal.com <anca at techliminal.com>>
>>  M: (510) 220-6660 <tel:%28510%29%20220-6660>
>> http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F:
>>  facebook.com/techliminal <http://facebook.com/techliminal>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rusty Lindgren
>> **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>  <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org<sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> >
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:22:28 -0800
>> From: Eddan Katz <eddan at clear.net>
>> To: Anon195714 <anon195714 at sbcglobal.net>
>> Cc: "sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org"
>>  <sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID: <53E0AF57-F2E7-4B85-A7F6-825D45B24A58 at clear.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> They threw everything they could at him, and in the lower court, the
>> Trademark over the name (& logo?) of the company stuck a bit, but was a
>> loser. The trade secret claim, which is under state unfair competition law,
>> was decided in favor of the lock company. Fanberg appealed. This is the
>> opinion from the appellate court reversing the lower court's decision that
>> Fanberg had misappropriated trade secrets.
>>
>> In order to qualify as a trade secret, you need only have confidential
>> stamps on it or physical barrier to secure the what-not. Encrypting
>> something would be a partial de facto way of asserting trade secret
>> protection, most definitely. What counts as eligible to be protected as
>> trade secrets? Most accurately vague definition I can think of is know-how.
>> People often associate it with "the secret sauce" in Coke, Big Macs, etc..
>> Many of you may have come across it in your employment agreement laying out
>> what you can't take with you when you leave.
>>
>> sent from eddan.com
>>
>> On Feb 28, 2013, at 11:06 AM, Anon195714 <anon195714 at sbcglobal.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi Eddan-
>>
>> So was Ace asserting some kind of copyright or other IP control over the
>> correlations between the key codes and the locks? That's funny: like
>> copyrighting the names & numbers in the phone book;-)
>>
>> What kind of lawful right would Ace have had to control those codes? I
>> don't see any.
>>
>> Classic case of "security by obscurity" in the face of the data being
>> openly available to anyone who just looks. That plus Ace not having
>> adequate steps in place to verify the identity of people asking for
>> duplicate keys ("security by laziness";-). (As if any burglar is going to
>> order keys and wait a week to get them, when smashing a window provides
>> instant gratification?)
>>
>> Meanwhile, it's since been demonstrated that Ace locks and other tubular
>> locks of same size, are tremendously easy to pick with a tool anyone can
>> make from a Bic pen housing.
>>
>> To my mind the main value of learning to pick locks is to become more
>> aware of one's own security environment: particularly the degree to which
>> we very often depend on crappy locks, and then, with the newly-acquired
>> situational awareness about locks, the degree to which we very often leave
>> open all manner of other security holes in our physical surroundings.
>> Nothing says "replace your front door lock now!" like being able to pick it
>> with two paper clips in less than a minute. And then you look at the big
>> window right next to the front door... and the un-shredded bills you put in
>> the recycle bin with your name & account numbers all over them... and the
>> valuables in the back seat of your car... etc.
>>
>> Next is the ability to get into places one has auth to be in: such as
>> when one locks oneself out of one's own house or car (or in my case, PBX
>> room on client site after hours, blush...).
>>
>> Equally is the ability to do likewise for friends (have done that a
>> handful of times).
>>
>> And from that, the generalization to our entire subculture, of the degree
>> of security awareness we should have all the time.
>>
>> Picking locks is like being able to disassemble, clean, and reassemble a
>> firearm: that skill does not make a law-abiding person start contemplating
>> committing murders. But it might make one start to think more about
>> personal safety on the streets at night.
>>
>> Lastly, I'll fess up to something. I think it's cool as hell when people
>> who ordinarily hack around with software, start hacking around with
>> _mechanical_ stuff. I'm bigtime in favor of people learning how to hack
>> around with _mechanical_ stuff. "Physical layer" as new playground. To this
>> list add your home appliances (the ones with motors in 'em) and rotary dial
>> phones, but that's another topic for another day.
>>
>> TTYs-
>>
>> -G.
>>
>>
>> =====
>>
>>
>> On 13-02-28-Thu 10:35 AM, Eddan Katz wrote:
>>
>> Chicago Lock v. Fanberg is the case I was telling you about last night,
>> J.D. - http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=17605115413487325945.
>> Author of lock-picking manuals gets sued by the manufacturer of the
>> locks. Chicago Lock loses on its trade secret misappropriation claim.
>> Here's an excerpt from the facts of the case -
>>
>> Appellant Victor Fanberg, the son of locksmith Morris Fanberg and a
>> locksmith in his own right, has published a number of locksmith manuals for
>> conventional locks. Realizing that no compilation had been made of tubular
>> lock key codes, in 1975 Fanberg advertised in a locksmith journal,
>> Locksmith Ledger, requesting that individual locksmiths transmit to him
>> serial number-key code correlations in their possession in exchange for a
>> copy of a complete compilation when finished. A number of locksmiths
>> complied, and in late 1976 Fanberg and his father began to sell a
>> two-volume publication of tubular lock codes, including those of Ace locks,
>> entitled "A-Advanced Locksmith's Tubular Lock Codes." In 1976 and 1977
>> Fanberg advertised in the manuals in the Locksmith Ledger for $49.95 and
>> indicated that it would be supplemented as new correlations became known.
>> See Excerpt at 95-98. About 350 manuals had been sold at the time of trial.
>> The District Court found that Fanberg "had lost or
>>
>> surrendered control over persons who could purchase the books," id. at
>> 98, meaning that nonlocksmiths could acquire the code manuals.
>>
>>
>> The books contain correlations which would allow a person equipped with a
>> tubular key grinding machine to make duplicate keys for any listed Ace lock
>> if the serial number of the lock was known. On some models, the serial
>> numbers appear on the exterior of the lock face. Thus, Fanberg's manuals
>> would make it considerably easier4*403 (and less expensive) for a person to
>> obtain (legitimately or illegitimately) duplicate keys to Ace locks without
>> going through the Company's screening process. This is what caused
>> consternation to the Company and some of its customers. At no time did
>> Fanberg seek, or the Company grant, permission to compile and sell the key
>> codes. Nor did the individual locksmiths seek authorization from the
>> Company or their customers before transmitting their key code data to
>> Fanberg.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/27/13 11:20 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu wrote:
>>
>> more:
>>
>>
>> http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_22683660/oakland-mayor-jean-quan-apologizes-promoting-lock-picking
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> It's awesome, free press!
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:40 PM, rusty lindgren <rustylindgren at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Oh dear gawd. This is possibly the most moronic piece of "journalism" I
>> have ever seen.
>>
>> Are they unaware of the fact that you can go to a lock-picking
>> school(actually it teaches you way more), and that this is just a cheaper
>> version of that? (see: http://www.lock411.com/training.html).
>>
>> Also, virtually no crime in Oakland involves skilled lock-picking,
>> because it's a waste of time.
>>
>> Don't worry though, you can train in deadly martial arts, go to the
>> shooting range, and buy ninja swords just about anywhere in Oakland, but
>> picking a Masterlock is "appalling".
>>
>> -Rusty
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Anca Mosoiu <anca at techliminal.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> Heads up. Looks like some folks aren't too happy that people are learning
>> how to pick locks this weekend.
>>
>> http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=9010047
>>
>> Here is Oakland Local's response:
>>
>>
>> http://m.oaklandlocal.com/article/oaklands-mayor-quan-apologizes-mentioning-weekend-lockpicking-class-really
>>
>> Anca
>>
>>
>> --
>> -=-=-=-
>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>> anca at techliminal.com
>> M: (510) 220-6660
>> http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F: facebook.com/techliminal
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rusty Lindgren
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:49:45 -0800
>> From: Shawn Lesniak <moderkaka at gmail.com>
>> Cc: sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID: <512FB4D9.6070402 at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> On 2013-02-28 01:13, Anon195714 wrote:>
>>
>> Re. Shawn:
>>
>> In no way am I suggesting that we start "working with the city or law
>> enforcement officers on reporting who shows up at events or assist them
>> in doing so," any more than the radical Quakers did.
>>
>>
>> I don't know anything about the radical Quakers and they are in no way a
>> litmus test for the right amount of cooperation with law enforcement.
>> You are in favor of undercover officers at sudoroom events. I am
>> uncomfortable with that in any amount.
>>
>>  What I _am_ advocating is to open the lines of communication and point
>> out that if the city is truly concerned about badguys showing up, they
>> can send someone along to hang out and observe for themselves. What
>> they're going to see is a room full of geeks learning an oldschool
>> mechanical skill. More likely they won't bother, in which case their
>> objection can be dismissed as meaningless.
>>
>>
>> The term city is ambiguous here. The mayor endorsed it at some level,
>> then some of her constituents were concerned. Some other people signed
>> up for the class. Oakland is a diverse city.
>>
>> The city government in cooperation with law enforcement is deeply afraid
>> of anarchists. What happens when they look into it further and realize
>> several known anarchists congregate at sudoroom? Maybe you don't care
>> because you're not an anarchist, and I'm hesitant to air out my
>> 'anarchist' credentials, but I've been beaten by Oakland police for
>> being a suspected anarchist. I'm not comfortable with inviting anyone
>> in for surveillance.
>> In addition, whether 'known gang members' are likely to show up or not,
>> the laws are no different for them than for us. If it were my class,
>> and someone told me to only teach white people or people without tattoos
>> or people who aren't wearing black shirts or any other restrictions, I'd
>> tell them to fuck off and if I caught anyone surveilling them I'd kick
>> them out.
>> Safe space to me means no LE in sudoroom, uniformed or undercover.
>>
>> As for comparing "'known gang member'" to "the more privileged class":
>> that's postmodern BS. The #1 killer of young black men in Oakland isn't
>> police bullets but gang bullets. So where are the outraged protests in
>> front of known gang enclaves, eh? This isn't an abstraction: a young
>> black man I knew was killed in a drive-by. As for "privileged class,"
>> about 1/3 of SudoRoom members are unemployed, and many are
>> borderline-homeless. A few more "privileges," such as full-time jobs
>> that pay decent wages, would be a good thing.
>>
>>
>> You don't have to kill someone to ruin their lives. Go out to East
>> Oakland and ask a few people what their experience with LE is. Sit in a
>> courtroom in Oakland for 2 hours and see what people are in jail for.
>> I've seen people spend 2 days in jail for riding their bike on the
>> sidewalk, which can lose you a job.
>> I've had a cop roll up on me aggressively while I was wearing a hood and
>> then immediately changed his demeanor when he saw I was white and let me
>> go. Life is different for PoC in Oakland. I've seen it myself and I've
>> spent the time talking to people who are affected.
>>
>> This is why I fight to keep schools open, to improve access to resources
>> for everyone. You close a school, you open a jail. You open a school,
>> you close a jail.
>>
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>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 12:31:08 -0800
>> From: mark burdett <mark at 510pen.org>
>> To: Anon195714 <anon195714 at sbcglobal.net>
>> Cc: sudo-discuss <sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>> Subject: Re: [sudo-discuss] FUD around Lockpicking class
>> Message-ID:
>> <CALd=3MLX5DcFU3ThT3dzmCyiQu9OyJSS=mSoB73kRO0dpEvdxw at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> No one is really inviting a detective, right? there are lots of reasons
>> not
>> to. like, I assume many of us have a policy of only talking to LE w/ our
>> lawyers..
>>
>> The "fundamentals of armed robbery" workshop suggested in the articles
>> could be quite informative! "fundamentals of computer fraud and abuse"
>> could be interesting too, although according to
>>
>> https://data.oaklandnet.com/Public-Safety/CrimeWatch-Maps-Past-90-Days/ym6k-rx7a
>> there
>> is quite a lot of robbery going on, hardly any "ACCESS COMPUTER/ALTER/ETC
>> DATA:DEVISE SCHEME/ETC DEFRAUD/ETC"
>>
>> --mark B.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 11:52 PM, Anon195714 <anon195714 at sbcglobal.net
>> >wrote:
>>
>>
>> Yo's-
>>
>> On the other hand, the Mayor could send along a plain-clothes detective to
>> hang out and keep an eye open for known gang members etc. "Just say
>> Honeypot!", and we're doing the city a favor.
>>
>> OK, so a few recent crime anecdotes:
>>
>> = A close friend's car window was smashed on the side street while we were
>> up at SudoRoom.
>> = Another close friend's bike was stolen out of the common area.
>> = A neighbor of mine's bike was stolen out of their garage today.
>> = The officer who took the stolen bike report (Berkeley PD) said that the
>> standard MO these days is for the robber to knock at the door, and if no
>> answer, kick the door in. If the resident is away it becomes a burglary.
>> If the resident is home, it becomes a home-invasion robbery or worse.
>> = As another close friend of mine once said, "doors are a convenience for
>> people who are polite." A strong lock on a strong door with a weak window
>> nearby, is evidence of nothing more or less than a homeowner without the
>> ability to imagine how baddies think.
>>
>> I don't see any lock-picking going on in any of those. As a method of
>> committing crimes, lock-picking is obsolete.
>>
>> And I do see an opportunity for some positive outreach to Mayor Quan's
>> office, re. the opportunity for having a detective attend the event. This
>> would be similar to how Quaker activist groups handled their plans for
>> protests, by keeping the relevant LE agencies informed. When I lived in
>> New England, I saw this first-hand, and it worked. Protests organized by
>> those groups were successful, every time.
>>
>> Does anyone here have good relations with anyone in Oakland city gov, and
>> want to volunteer to get the lines of communication open?
>>
>> -G.
>>
>>
>> =====
>>
>>
>>
>> On 13-02-27-Wed 11:26 PM, Tommy York wrote:
>>
>> "OAKLAND -- One skill that appears all too common in Oakland these days
>> is the ability to pick a lock. Burglaries jumped more than 40 percent last
>> year, and not all of them involved window smashes."
>>
>> This is a horrific excuse for journalism. Not all burglaries involved
>> window smashes? Oh really? And in that case, how many involved skilled
>> lock
>> picking?
>>
>> Mencken would be angry.
>>
>> - tommy
>> -----------------
>> Thomas Riley York (???) 510.926.0510
>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/tommyyork
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 11:20 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu <zamfire at gmail.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>> more:
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_22683660/oakland-mayor-jean-quan-apologizes-promoting-lock-picking
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>> It's awesome, free press!
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:40 PM, rusty lindgren <rustylindgren at gmail.com
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Oh dear gawd. This is possibly the most moronic piece of "journalism"
>> I have ever seen.
>>
>> Are they unaware of the fact that you can go to a lock-picking
>> school(actually it teaches you way more), and that this is just a cheaper
>> version of that? (see: http://www.lock411.com/training.html).
>>
>> Also, virtually no crime in Oakland involves skilled lock-picking,
>> because it's a waste of time.
>>
>> Don't worry though, you can train in deadly martial arts, go to the
>> shooting range, and buy ninja swords just about anywhere in Oakland, but
>> picking a Masterlock is "appalling".
>>
>> -Rusty
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Anca Mosoiu <anca at techliminal.com>wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> Heads up. Looks like some folks aren't too happy that people are
>> learning how to pick locks this weekend.
>>
>>
>> http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=9010047
>>
>>  Here is Oakland Local's response:
>>
>>
>>
>> http://m.oaklandlocal.com/article/oaklands-mayor-quan-apologizes-mentioning-weekend-lockpicking-class-really
>>
>> Anca
>>
>>
>> --
>> -=-=-=-
>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>> anca at techliminal.com
>> M: (510) 220-6660 <%28510%29%20220-6660>
>> http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F: facebook.com/techliminal
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rusty Lindgren
>> **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sudo-discuss mailing listsudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.orghttp://
>> lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>>
>>
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>> End of sudo-discuss Digest, Vol 4, Issue 208
>> ********************************************
>>
>>
>>
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