[sudo-discuss] RAYC's membership

Tue Feb 3 16:58:41 PST 2015

Jehan, my sincere thanks for taking me to task on that remark. I will ask
the individuals if they're comfortable sharing their input about RAYC
directly, and until then, everyone, please ignore that hearsay. Thanks also
for the affirmation – I respect RAYC's energy and especially his diffusion
of the space-invader last night. I pledge to get to know him more
in-personally.

On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:47 AM, Jehan Tremback <jehan.tremback at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Idunno you can't just drop "have stated that RAYC's presence is a major
> reason why they don't come to Omni anymore" and not clarify it at all. If
> you're not able to explain in some way, then don't bring it into the
> discussion. Dropping dark hints with no elaboration helps no one.
>
> As far as RAYC goes, I've known him for the few years that I have visited
> bay area hackerspaces, and while he is problematic at times, he is also one
> of the few people who really spends most of their time cleaning and
> improving the space. If there are reasons to block him that outweigh his
> work, let's hear them.
>
> -Jehan
>
> On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 2:46 PM, Danny Spitzberg <stationaery at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Niki, I agree that it's important to approach new folks - apologies if
>> my earlier message was less than loving.  I was happy and appreciative
>> at first with RAYC, but it became much too much. I'll add that other
>> individuals I've spoken with have stated that RAYC's presence is a major
>> reason why they don't come to Omni anymore (happy to clarify on that
>> off-thread).
>>
>> <3<4<5,
>> D
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 2:09 PM, niki <niki.shelley at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I'm glad that there are people here who are looking out / engaging
>>> w/people they don't know, honestly.
>>>
>>> I'll talk to RAYC about the "enthusiasm" with which he does so. I'd
>>> encourage others in the community to do the same. Let's recognize that RAYC
>>> does seem to have the community's best interests at heart and to
>>> communicate lovingly.
>>>
>>> <3
>>>
>>> N
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 1:55 PM, Danny Spitzberg <stationaery at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I believe I met RAYC last Tuesday - 5'10"ish, short hair, rapid talker
>>>> - he got all up in my face repeatedly as I was doing inventory of a/v
>>>> equipment for the Omni wiki. I was clearly using a clipboard and camera
>>>> with intention to record info, working with Kwe, but RAYC hit me with a
>>>> litany of questions lik,e Hey are you new here, Hey are you looking for
>>>> anyone, Hey can I help you find something... As if he was security at his
>>>> own club house. I told him repeatedly what I was doing and why and said
>>>> thanks but no thanks for his help and he persisted.
>>>>
>>>>  No harm no foul, I guess, but that was super-duper aggravating.
>>>>
>>>>  I'm unclear what RAYC's status is with Sudo and/or Omni, but wanted
>>>> to add this for the record.
>>>>
>>>> Happy Sunday!
>>>>
>>>> D
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jan 8, 2015 at 12:28 PM, Torrie Fischer <
>>>> tdfischer at hackerbots.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Feel free to try throwing more mediation at RAYC. You'll be sorely
>>>>> disappointed.
>>>>>
>>>>> We tried for months to talk him down and convince him that there was
>>>>> no
>>>>> conspiracy. Mitch tried to have a meeting with him to talk about it
>>>>> but RAYC
>>>>> disrespected Mitch's time by canceling a few minutes before it
>>>>> started. I
>>>>> personally wandered around in the mission until 2am with him while I
>>>>> tried to
>>>>> talk with him and convince him that while we all love him and are
>>>>> appreciative
>>>>> of his contributions, he needs to take a vacation. Instead I got
>>>>> screamed at
>>>>> and told that I'm part of the problem.
>>>>>
>>>>> Noisebridge has collectively addressed the problem by excluding him
>>>>> from
>>>>> participation in the community. We tried. He is physically incapable
>>>>> of
>>>>> receiving mediation.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, January 08, 2015 12:16:06 PM Sam Tepper wrote:
>>>>> > There are many complaints that NB members (and a few sudo
>>>>> co-members)
>>>>> > have against Rayc. Not all of them are valid, but we should not
>>>>> > oversimplify this out of respect for everyone's perceptions and
>>>>> > viewpoints. Rayc certainly will need to make a written statement (as
>>>>> > was mentioned at the meeting), which should resolve some of this and
>>>>> > take it to a more factual realm.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > From my understanding, there have been some attempts at NB for
>>>>> > conflict mediation, yet nobody has fully followed through with the
>>>>> > process. The issues are involved enough that I believe that agreeing
>>>>> > upon a moderator or mediator, in this case, might be appropriate.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Rayc has certainly contributed positively to Sudo and NB, yet there
>>>>> > are certain specific actions and incidents which perhaps still need
>>>>> to
>>>>> > be addressed.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On 01/08/2015 11:55 AM, hol at gaskill.com wrote:
>>>>> > > That's what people felt - we needed more time to establish how he
>>>>> > > intends to use the space and interact w/ others. Also discussed
>>>>> was
>>>>> > > that really, we should probably take this time for ALL new members
>>>>> > > instead of just giving it a week.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Please anyone interested consider proposing amendments to our
>>>>> > > membership process:
>>>>> > >
>>>>> https://sudoroom.org/wiki/Articles_of_Association#Section_2.1.0_Process_fo
>>>>> > > r_becoming_a_member>
>>>>> > > Here are some notes from noisebridge meetings below, just did a
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > little digging today
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Banned for 6 months - agrees to stay out for that time:
>>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_03_11
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Comes up for perma-ban, which is blocked:
>>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_03_18
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Discussion for 2 meetings RE unbanning:
>>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_04_22
>>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_04_29
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Sounds like one of the main people pushing for his ban was also
>>>>> > > banned and/or removed from the 'council' but either way, the
>>>>> > > consensus was that we will proceed with an open mind and listen to
>>>>> > > all the facts.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Cheers
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > On 2015-01-08 11:34, Adam Munich wrote:
>>>>> > >> From what I've gathered from his discussions about it there was
>>>>> > >> apparently some sort of miscommunication between the people
>>>>> > >> running Noisebridge and electricians, which rayc tried to
>>>>> > >> resolve. The people who were supposed to be doing the job didn't
>>>>> > >> like that somehow.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> Granted that's only his side of the story and I don't know the
>>>>> > >> other side, but overall rayc has been rather valuable in keeping
>>>>> > >> sudo clean and organized. I feel like it's worth giving him a
>>>>> > >> chance.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> Cheers, -Adam On Jan 8, 2015 11:04 AM, <hol at gaskill.com> wrote:
>>>>> > >> It was already blocked by several people due to some concerns -
>>>>> > >> among them is that he didn't mention the situation RE Noisebridge
>>>>> > >> at all until prompted, which didn't convey a sense of openness
>>>>> > >> and honesty. I believe someone is reaching out to him to get more
>>>>> > >> info on the situation so probably best not to make it the subject
>>>>> > >> of a meeting until there's been a chance to hear everyone out
>>>>> > >> offline. I left at 10:30 so may have missed who that was - if it
>>>>> > >> wasn't delegated to anyone I'll contact him.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> cheers
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> On 2015-01-08 10:02, Torrie Fischer wrote: Hei, sudo room.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> I want to avoid as much conflict as possible here on discuss@ so
>>>>> > >> I'll state up front that I would really rather folks talk to me
>>>>> > >> in person or off list in response to this.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> I had every intention of coming to Sudo last night as I
>>>>> > >> infrequently do to see whats up and hack on things and spend more
>>>>> > >> time in the space. My knee disagreed to I went home instead.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> Had I made it I would've certainly blocked RAYC's membership.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> I plan on showing up at Sudo Room next week to have a legitimate
>>>>> > >> block in person since phoning it in as I'm doing in this e-mail
>>>>> > >> is bullshit and we all know that. I would appreciate it a bunch
>>>>> > >> if others were around to hear me elaborate about my principled
>>>>> > >> objection and give feedback if it has any standing. I also don't
>>>>> > >> think its all that excellent of an idea to try and discuss this
>>>>> > >> on a wednesday night when folks want to just get together and be
>>>>> > >> positive, so I'll certainly be making more of an effort to be at
>>>>> > >> the space before then for discussion.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >> Again, I'm not going to respond to this on the list but feel free
>>>>> > >> to poke me off-list or AFK :)
>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>>> > >> mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>> > >> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss [1]
>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>>> > >> mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>> > >> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss [1]
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Links: ------ [1] https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>>> > > mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>> > > https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>> >
>>>>> > _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>
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