[sudo-discuss] johnny ban / process?

[Marina Kukso]

i apologize that i misunderstood what we had agreed on during the
remediation.

On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 11:30 AM, Lesley Bell <zvezdalune at gmail.com> wrote:

> I find it kind of humiliating that this has to be so public. I feel that
> it shows poor judgement on my part to have ignored and suppressed my own
> feelings for so long in this situation. The humorless feminist straw man is
> a scary thing to be policed with, if I have an excuse. I give people the
> benefit of the doubt, I accept a lot of communication styles, so I laughed
> the first half dozen or so times he called me something awful in a way that
> was plausibly-kidding-but-really-not.
>
> And that's how I wound up spending months getting harassed, having my
> sleep disturbed, by someone who felt entitled to treat me any way he liked.
> Who respected my physical autonomy so little that he could threaten to hurt
> me, and laugh when I was afraid, and touch me when I told him not to.
>
> Marina, we never agreed to that. I agreed to have some understanding of
> Johnny's position of not remembering one thing he said due to being very
> drunk, and acknowledging that there might be other factors at play, but
> that's absolutely what happened.
>
> There was no talk of me being evicted or kicked out until he drunkenly
> told me he'd "almost kicked me out like three times over sexual tension."
> He doesn't remember this, but he said it.
>
> His email that tells me to get out was a direct reply to my email telling
> him his behavior was inappropriate and scary and needed to stop.
>
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016, 11:10 AM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Marina,
>>
>> I appreciate your offer, and your past willingness to mediate. However,
>> due to the results of the past mediation, I am not comfortable having you
>> mediate at this time.
>>
>> Your repeated suggestion that Johnny might just be joking and I should
>> reframe his insults/harassment as humor did not prove to be helpful, as
>> evidenced by his subsequent criminal breaking and entering and physical
>> assault. I also did not feel that his words in your presence were sincere,
>> as he repeated some of his inappropriate behavior very soon afterward.
>>
>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016, 10:56 AM Marc Juul <juul at labitat.dk> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, July 20, 2016, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> aside from any other issues, i sincerely doubt that this is a game to
>>>> johnny given that he wants to participate in the space..
>>>>
>>>> let's focus on "restorative" instead of "retributive" - johnny seems
>>>> (to me) to want to follow the process in a good faith way. for anyone who
>>>> is more familiar with the omni and sudo remediation process than i am, any
>>>> ideas on how to move forward from here?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Accusations are one thing but the way people choose to respond to
>>> accusations is usually a very good predictor of whether they end up with a
>>> resolved conflict and regaining access to the space.
>>>
>>> After Johnny's comments in this thread I predict that he will not be
>>> allowed back any time soon.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 7:24 AM, robb <sf99er at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> #swish?
>>>>>
>>>>> really, this is all just a game to you johnny?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 3:46 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd at gmail.com
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Johnny,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is it true that Lesley's has a temporary restraining order against
>>>>>> you? That seems to rise above mere "gossip and accusations", and seems like
>>>>>> it would be substantial enough to trigger at least a temporary ban.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, it's the nature of interpersonal conflicts that there may not
>>>>>> be any more than "accusations" available to make a decision on. So if
>>>>>> someone states that they feel unsafe around another person, it may be
>>>>>> justified to remove that other person from the space at least temporarily,
>>>>>> until a better informed decision can be reached.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Patrik
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 20, 2016 2:16 AM, "Johnny" <mostmodernist at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> that link says if "someone's safety is at risk, a temporary ban may
>>>>>> be placed".  it says nothing about how, and obviously is meant to deal with
>>>>>> clear present safety issues, not gossip and accusations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> abusing that vague apparatus of the super-system to ban people on
>>>>>> mere claims is totally fascist and supremacist behavior.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> defending it is also fascist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> calling out for the record that Marc, Matt, Cere, Sigma, Jeremy are
>>>>>> fascists for consent to abuse system and unjustly override process without
>>>>>> sudo quorum; ya'll better not step on any cracks!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 12:53 AM, Marc Juul <juul at labitat.dk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 12:43 AM, Johnny <mostmodernist at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Marc,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No quorum you say?  Sub-Section 3.2.2 "Maintaining Safe Space
>>>>>>>> During Conflict Resolution" states that my ban would have had to been
>>>>>>>> ratified online without quorum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The sudo room space, being part of Omni, is also subject to all Omni
>>>>>>> rules, including the Omni safer space policy which I linked previously.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> marc/juul
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
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