[sudo-discuss] Proposed changes to the articles of association

Wed May 14 23:48:49 PDT 2014

sounds good. something that might help in documentation is an explicit
message on the application form (or wherever) that "membership is typically
granted barring some serious circumstances or reservations and that you
shouldn't take the application questions extremely seriously because you're
worried it might hurt your chances of being accepted - just feel free to be
honest." that wording's not very good, but i think you get the idea.

On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 11:22 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com>wrote:

> ah yes, I think the idea for that was to generally side on not specifying
> too narrowly, but instead to use "human judgment over automation and
> efficiency" and cultural protocol to navigate it. I think "serious issues"
> is a metric we are giving to future sudo room members in order for them to
> weigh heavily whether some issue that potentially prevents a member from
> joining is in fact of a "serious" nature. I'm of the disposition this means
> something that conflicts directly with sudo room's values and the articles
> of association.
>
> I actually think this process could be fairly easy to go through that
> doesn't need to be very intimidating. At the meeting tonight, everyone was
> in favor of putting time into implementing a better experience for new
> members so that this policy is clearly outlined and available in multiple
> formats (paper, on the website, etc)
>
>
> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 11:15 PM, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> thanks matt. i like both of the changed wordings that you've suggested.
>> i'd be happy with either version.
>>
>> still wondering about the second issue - what "serious issues" might be
>> and what the criteria are that the group would vote people up or down on.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 11:10 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Phil,
>>>
>>> I think nothing in this policy *prevents *tele-presence, in fact, I
>>> think it would be prudent for a prospective member to, at the very least,
>>> offer to attend the meeting virtually if they cannot be physically present.
>>> Either way, the only requirement is the prospective member submits
>>> something concrete, in writing (format unspecified, so digital text seems
>>> fine).
>>>
>>> Marina,
>>>
>>> I have no strong feelings about the exact phrasing, I think those
>>> questions were carried over from Jake's original(ish) proposal, maybe?
>>> Marc, do you know where those questions came from?
>>>
>>> I do like the idea of asking questions to get three kinds of responses:
>>> 1. A response about why they are interested, leaving the opportunity for
>>> setting some context to joining.
>>> 2. A response about what specifically they want to do (commonly folks
>>> have particular projects or uses in mind as they get involved with sudo)
>>> 2. A response about specifically how they see themselves contributing to
>>> the community, as giving some sort contribution *is* an expectation,
>>> but extremely open / liberal. I think "share" is a great term to express
>>> this.
>>>
>>> I have no reason to think we should hang on to the question about
>>> "hacking" in particular, maybe alternatives:
>>>
>>> #** What is your (pseudo)nym and/or name?
>>> #** Why do you want to be a member of sudo room?
>>> #** Do you happen to have something in mind that you would like to do at
>>> sudo room?
>>> #** Do you happen to have something in mind that you would like to share
>>> with the sudo room community?
>>>
>>> That being said, I'd also be happy with the truncated version:
>>>
>>>  #** What is your (pseudo)nym and/or name?
>>> #** Why do you want to be a member of sudo room?
>>>
>>> // Matt
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 9:38 PM, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> thanks and apologies that i haven't had a chance to be a part of this
>>>> discussion until now. i have a few questions:
>>>>
>>>> - re: "What are you excited about hacking at sudo room?" & "What are
>>>> you excited about sharing with sudo room?" i wonder what effect seeing
>>>> these questions on the application would have for someone who's really new
>>>> to the world of hacking and/or someone who might not identify as a hacker
>>>> (ie, someone who would consider themselves a "beginner" or "just learning"
>>>> - as many of our members, including myself, do). like if you're not sure
>>>> what you're interested on hacking...or if you're not sure what you have to
>>>> share with sudo room. is anyone else concerned that these questions might
>>>> be intimidating to newcomers? (i ask this genuinely). also, what happens if
>>>> a prospective member puts on their application "i don't know" or "i'm not
>>>> sure" for these questions? would that affect their application?
>>>>
>>>> this leads to my second question:
>>>>
>>>> Under "initial pondering" it says "#** The intent is for it to be very
>>>> easy for new members to join, so only very serious concerns should be
>>>> brought up." what would a "serious concern" be? also there isn't really any
>>>> indication like..what the yes/no on a person's membership request is based
>>>> on. does the content of what people put in their application matter?
>>>>
>>>> finally, what do folks think is gained by the hacking & sharing q's? do
>>>> you think that you wouldn't get enough information from "what is your
>>>> pseudonym/name" and "why do you want to be a member of sudo room?"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 9:15 PM, Marc Juul <juul at labitat.dk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> These are the proposed changes brought up at the current sudo room
>>>>> meeting. We will attempt to consense on this at the sudo room meeting on
>>>>> Wednesday the 21st of May at 7 pm in sudo room.
>>>>>
>>>>> ===Section 2.1 Qualifications for Membership===
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>>
>>>>> * Successfully completing the process for becoming a member, below:
>>>>>
>>>>> ====Section 2.1.0 Process for becoming a member====
>>>>>
>>>>> #'''Declaration of Intent to Join'''
>>>>> #* To become a member, a person must submit a brief written or spoken
>>>>> "Declaration of Intent to Join" where they answer the following
>>>>> questions:
>>>>> #** What is your (pseudo)nym and/or name?
>>>>> #** Why do you want to be a member of sudo room?
>>>>> #** What are you excited about hacking at sudo room?
>>>>> #** What are you excited about sharing with sudo room?
>>>>> #'''Initial Pondering'''
>>>>> #* It is only possible to become a member at the weekly sudo room
>>>>> meeting. Prospective members should attend if possible but can submit a
>>>>> written declaration if they are not able to attend in person.
>>>>> #* At the sudo room weekly meeting, every prospective member must
>>>>> leave the room while the existing members have a chance to bring up any
>>>>> concerns or reasons why the prospective member(s) should not be
>>>>> allowed membership (referred to as the "Initial Pondering").
>>>>> #** The intent is for it to be very easy for new members to join, so
>>>>> only very serious concerns should be brought up.
>>>>> #** If any existing member objects to a prospective new member
>>>>> becoming a member, and this cannot be resolved through discussion, then the
>>>>> prospective member will not be allowed membership.
>>>>> #** Unreasonable or frequent blocking of new members by an existing
>>>>> member is grounds for immediate termination of membership based on a 2/3
>>>>> vote.
>>>>> #*  Upon completing the "Initial Pondering", such prospective members
>>>>> must be communicated to the sudo room mailing list within 24 hours,
>>>>> including their "Declaration of Intent to Join".
>>>>> #'''Extended Pondering'''
>>>>> #* After the Initial Pondering, if there are no objections, there
>>>>> will be one week for sudo room members to raise objections as to why the
>>>>> prospective member should not be allowed to join (referred to as the
>>>>> "Extended Pondering").
>>>>> #* If there are no objections raised during the "Extended Pondering", the
>>>>> prospective member will become a member.
>>>>> #** The intention is to provide sufficient time to ensure all concerns
>>>>> of those unable to attend the meeting may be heard.
>>>>> #* The new member will be added to the membership list and given
>>>>> access to desired and relevant assets and services of sudo room.
>>>>> #* No announcement of this change of status after the "Extended
>>>>> Pondering" is necessary.
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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