[sudo-discuss] Today 4/4/15: Pidgen and Daren have been temp banned for safer spaces policy violations

Mon Apr 6 11:29:21 PDT 2015

I lurk on the sudo list and I like periodically reading these threads about
how you handle difficult people.

It's really interesting because most voluntary associations exclude people
they find difficult by informal and sort of secret means - participants
talk in groups of 2s and 3s, "gossip," a group consensus emerges that they
don't like someone, then they shut that person out by withholding
information about future social gatherings. Also, they avoid the problem in
the first place by being immediately hostile to whole categories of people
who strike them as eccentric.

Sudo room is different - it's more radically inclusive from the get, and
it's filled with people who are committed to consistent open processes. I
like reading to see how your process is the same and different from the
ordinary implicit process of social exclusion.

On Monday, April 6, 2015, WIld Cat <wildcatofthewoods at gmail.com> wrote:

> So I have known Darin for years and he has been called out for all of this
> behavior before and still hasn't learned. In terms of him misgendering me
> it seemed malicious because he accentuated " man" there were several
> witnesses to his extremely aggressive behavior that was a defensive
> response to me calmly asking why he was yelling at Babs.  sexual harassment
> is not OK. I don't think you can speak for the other people who have called
> him out for inappropriate flirting. I had the conflict mediated by Joe but
> but still just acts the same to different people. I would propose a month
> ban at least so he gets that its not being accountable will have serious
> consequences.
>
> On Sunday, April 5, 2015, Rachel Wolfsohn <rawjnana at gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','rawjnana at gmail.com');>> wrote:
>
>> This is the last email I will include sudodisxuss on for this thread...
>>
>> Darin is currently undergoing mediation, and should be given the chance
>> to do so before a ban goes through.
>>
>> I have a blocking concern for such a ban on darin....
>>
>> My belief that darin can change enough, however slowly, is justified and
>> potent.
>>
>> I have seen he already has. In front of me at least, he no longer
>> misgenders anyone, including those ppl he previously had, after we
>> discussed it one night. Even if he's pissed at them. An immediate
>> improvement from the heart and higher self layered under psychic shit like
>> we all have to deal with just like him, is what I see...He is actively
>> working, works hard in general and physically protects ppl from harassment
>> daily.
>>
>> Misgendering:
>> I too have been editing "he" for "them" with you Wildcat, because your
>> gender pronoun is recent news to me as well as to many others.
>> I strive to use They, bc of respect for trans identity in general, and
>> ALSO camaraderie with you.
>> But it takes a little time, and it is in good faith with continuous
>> editing on my part, as it is for others.
>> I'm really sorry you are hurt by misgendering and will do my best to
>> correct the instances I witness. As I'm sure Darin will too,  now that this
>> information is available
>>
>> Sexual Language:
>> Darin is working on this too. I have twice hung out with darin and neded
>> to comment on his comments, asking him to hold his tongue, bc it was TMI
>> about his sexual thoughts.
>> It was not safe space language, and I asked him to.hold his tongue, but
>> not an implication of action either, more like expression.
>> Without FAIL he immediately apologizes and aims to hold back such
>> comments. He is actively learning what to reserve to his private thoughts
>> and I appreciate it from the bottom of my heart...
>>
>> Thus, I have a blocking.concern for this ban suggested for Darin
>>
>> Love, seriously, love,
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 05, 2015 at 10:31 AM, Torrie Fischer <
>> tdfischer at hackerbots.net> wrote:
>>
>> Theres community issues, then theres "issues that involve the hundreds of
>> people subscribed to sudo-discuss".
>>
>> This is not one of those issues. I have no involvement with this. I don't
>> want
>> to get involved with this. I'd honestly rather not hear about who is
>> fighting
>> who, or see people tearing down each other in public. I'd rather just
>> hack a
>> thing and assume that Sudo Room is a happy cheery place that has their
>> shit
>> together and everyone gets along.
>>
>> My Ƀ0.02.
>>
>> On Saturday, April 04, 2015 03:37:39 PM WIld Cat wrote:
>> > These are community issues not personal issues.
>> >
>> > On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>
>> wrote:
>> > > Sudoers,
>> > >
>> > > Respectfully can I suggest that you find another way to address
>> issues of
>> > > a personal nature and character assassinations or public shaming other
>> > > than
>> > > this public mailing list?  Why anyone would want to go to Sudo room
>> after
>> > > reading this  mailing list is beyond my comprehension.  And it really
>> is a
>> > > great place.  Can anyone think of another venue for these types of
>> > > discussions?
>> > >
>> > > Tracy
>> > > On Apr 4, 2015, at 2:41 PM, WIld Cat <wildcatofthewoods at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Daren returned to the space about 20 mins after trying to re-enter and
>> > > said to me " Do you want to go a couplwe blocks away from here and
>> handle
>> > > this like an adult."
>> > >
>> > > Pidgen is claiming that I threatened her and I did tell her that "you
>> need
>> > > to chill out or some shit is going to happen" but I also clarified by
>> > > saying "I am not threatening you with any form of violence."
>> > >
>> > > Darin is claiming that Babs sexually assaulted someone but Darin did
>> not
>> > > give any details of what happened.
>> > >
>> > > On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 2:00 PM, WIld Cat <wildcatofthewoods at gmail.com
>> >
>> > >
>> > > wrote:
>> > >> Today Pidgen was asked to leave in violation of the safer spaces
>> policy
>> > >> on an admitted account of sexual assault in the past as well as
>> recent
>> > >> behaviors of harassment. Daren was asked to leave in violation of the
>> > >> safer
>> > >> spaces policy by aggressive  behavior (aggressive swearing,
>> intentional
>> > >> misgendering, inappropriate sexual comments (Told me in an
>> aggressive way
>> > >> that he liked phone sex, than began to yell at me.) He has had a
>> history
>> > >> of
>> > >> being banned from spaces for similar behaviors of sexual harassment
>> and
>> > >> inappropriate behavior.
>> > >>
>> > >> I would like to begin a mediation process for Daren and I do not feel
>> > >> safe with him being in the space during such process.
>> > >>
>> > >> To my knowledge there is an ongoing mediation between Pidgen and
>> Centi.
>> > >> that Pidgen has allegedly violated due to harassing behavior. Pidgen
>> has
>> > >> been banned from several other radical spaces for entitlement
>> problems -
>> > >> theft - aggressive behaivor - accountability issues.
>> > >> I do not feel safe in the presences of Pidgen and would call on the
>> > >> community to permanently ban Pidgen.
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > sudo-discuss mailing list
>> > > sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>> > > https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>

-- 
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Housing Production. Tuesday April 7th:
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