I came across the story of this neighborhood mesh network in DC and thought
I'd share. They're using Commotion firmware on Ubiquity routers. They've
only managed to get a handful of nodes up but I think their experience is
informative.
I like his posts Start With People and Treat it like Infrastructure,
http://mountpleasantcwn.net/blog/
This marketing doc is good,
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B3YVvUQQSjTpTkg5YkxNLXVXR3M/edit?pli=1
Rad meeting tonight! Here are notes, which shall be cross-posted to the
wiki: http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Mesh
=Action Items=
==Immediate==
*OpenITP Grant - throw in your thoughts! -
https://pad.riseup.net/p/510penITPapp - due March 31st
*Market research on 4MB routers that will run OpenWRT
*Juul will research binoculars and send info to Mark (carryover item)
*Testing with satellite dishes - in sudo room next week! (after the main
meeting)
==Longer Term==
*Send out map and work on it
*Update website
**Commenting on nodes (Revent, Tidepools)
*Come up with a handout for going door-to-door
=Attendees=
Jenny, Miguel, Mark B, Bill, Jordan, with some OaklandWiki meshing ;D,
=Notes=
*How the site works:
**Create an account and put in the MAC address of the mesh router
**Allows us to build a list of all the routers on the network
*openmesh firmware runs a shell script when first installed, connects to
openmesh.org and our own instance, 510pen, is recognized and fed directly
to the router
*How the portal currently works:
**Pushes the HTML to openmesh.com if it updates
*How the portal could work:
**Data source on the mesh, some IP, every router could use static pages
(using javascript restful endpoints)
*We should get more routers! 8MB preferably, 4MB might work
*We'd need more CPU - WRT4GL's should work - CPU can easily be maxed out
depending on size of the mesh
*Installing fibre along International Blvd - a highspeed access point would
make it worthwhile to shoot across the city
*Research fibre in East Oakland
*Mesh nodes for GSM
*RanchWiFi - Solar ISP - Matt's connection
*Sudo GSM! We use all the protocols at sudo!!
*Old Sonic routers??
**Opt-in with Sonic? - Dane Jasper
*Should we abandon OpenMesh and flash routers with our own firmware? At the
very least, we should field test the firmwares out there.
*OpenMesh used to use OLSR, and is proud to have switched to batman-adv
*802.11s - mesh standard - what's the deal?
*BattleMesh!!! 4/20 in Denmark - we should keep tabs on how that pans out.
Or.. go?
=Reportbacks=
*Jenny followed up in #oti on weatherproof equipment Ubiquiti equipments
*Jenny and Mark B presented 510pen at Open Oakland.
*Follow up with Tony on Cisco connection - "how many routers do you need?"
he asked at Open Oakland meeting. Mark's answer, "ideally, one in every
other house."
*Bill did not flash the router ;) but his Coursera course is ending soon!
bOm,
Jenny
http://jennyryan.nethttp://thepyre.orghttp://thevirtualcampfire.orghttp://technomadic.tumblr.com
`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
"Technology is the campfire around which we tell our stories."
-Laurie Anderson
"Storytelling reveals meaning without committing the error of defining it."
-Hannah Arendt
"To define is to kill. To suggest is to create."
-Stéphane Mallarmé
~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
Meeting minutes are also archived here:
http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Mesh/21_February_2013
=Attendees=
Mark, Juul, Jenny, Bill, Miguel, Dres
=Debrief from Saturday's field trip=
*Replaced router at the Bikery in San Antonio (1) and Matt's house in
Fruitvale (2)
*Installed new router at the Bikery's second location (in the same building
as LOLspace) (3)
*Scoped out the rooftop situation at the LOL/SOL building
=Research=
*Bill did [[
http://lists.sudoroom.org/pipermail/mesh/2013-February/000017.html research
on OLSR / routing protocols]
*Juul did [
http://lists.sudoroom.org/pipermail/mesh/2013-February/000021.html research
on what's needed to do rooftop tests]
=Equipment Needs=
*Binoculars w/ built-in compass
*Normal compasses if the above can't be procured
*Tripods for mounting antennas
*Wifi USB dongles
*Wifi measuring device (from Ubiquiti)
*Weather-resistent enclosures
*Walkie talkies!
=Ideas=
*Wifi-based microwave interference detector
*Ham certification gives you some privileges on the wifi frequencies (up to
50 watts!?)
*Alameda island mesh network attempt:
http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.network.wireless.alameda
*We should assess wifi rane in crappy weather conditions
*Schools, libraries, city buildings
=Needs Assessment=
*How much equipment can we procure from donations?
*DD-WRT and OpenWRT compliance with various kinds of routers
=Sudo Room Inventory=
*OpenMesh MR500
*1 Linksys WRT54GL v.1.1 (4 MB)
*2 Linksys WAP54G v.3.1 (2 MB)
=Action Items=
*Research on outdoor weatherproof equipment
**Jenny will talk to Commotion folks
*Work on OpenITP proposal.
*Work on proposal for OpenOakland / City of Oakland.
---------
Jenny
http://jennyryan.nethttp://thepyre.orghttp://thevirtualcampfire.orghttp://technomadic.tumblr.com
`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
"Technology is the campfire around which we tell our stories."
-Laurie Anderson
"Storytelling reveals meaning without committing the error of defining it."
-Hannah Arendt
"To define is to kill. To suggest is to create."
-Stéphane Mallarmé
~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
I chatted in #OTI today re: weatherproof equipment. OTI (Open Technology
Institute) is the org supporting the Commotion project. It was suggested
that more support could be garnered through joining the commotion-dev
mailing list: https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/commotion-dev
-------------------------------------------
(12:32:35 PM) tunabananas1: I am seeking suggestions for outdoor
weatherproof equipment for mesh setups! ping jrbaldwin1
(12:42:52 PM) andygunn: tunabananas1: What info do you need about mesh
equipment?
(12:43:15 PM) andygunn: We usually use Ubiquiti equipment, since it is our
development platform for Commotion stuff
(12:52:54 PM) tunabananas1: andygunn: so in the wild ubiquiti APs need no
additional weatherproofing?
(12:53:16 PM) andygunn: Nope. If you use the outdoor rated equipment from
Ubiquiti, they are fine
(12:53:27 PM) andygunn: Most of their gear is outdoor, they only have a few
things that are indoor
(12:53:36 PM) andygunn: Such as some switches, routers, a few access points
(12:53:54 PM) andygunn: All PicoStations, Rockets, Nano_ units are outdoor
rated
(12:54:21 PM) andygunn: As long as outdoor rated Ethernet cable is used as
well, most installs are fairly weatherproof
(12:54:46 PM) andygunn: In fact, additional weatherproofing (such as mastic
or caulk) can cause issues with water ingress
(12:56:07 PM) andygunn: One caveat: Ubiquiti Bullet equipment may require
additional weatherproofing
(12:56:07 PM) tunabananas1: good to know! i will share with the 510pen team
(12:56:17 PM) andygunn: depending on the antenna they are attached to
(12:56:27 PM) andygunn: the N-type connector isn't 100% waterproof
(12:56:35 PM) andygunn: Though it is pretty good
(12:57:31 PM) andygunn: Sure. Who is the 510pen team?
(12:57:52 PM) andygunn: You can put them in contact with me directly if you
want
(12:58:50 PM) tunabananas1: 510pen is an East Bay (SFBay) mesh network
project that began in 2009
(12:59:04 PM) andygunn: Cool, good to know.
(12:59:26 PM) tunabananas1: but they didn't secure funding and kinda
stalled in 2011
(12:59:50 PM) andygunn: Word. That would be a problem.
(01:00:14 PM) tunabananas1: since i started interning with oti/tidepools
i've been helping to resuscitate it, so i'm doing a lot of the comms /
project management - personally less on the technical side of things
(01:00:47 PM) tunabananas1: https://510pen.org &&
http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Mesh
(01:01:30 PM) tunabananas1: ah, i see legind is in here. he's part of the
crew. o/
(01:02:00 PM) andygunn: I will check out those sites. Glad to hear there is
a "new" network in the works!
(01:02:33 PM) tunabananas1: yeah! mesh the planet!
(01:03:52 PM) tunabananas1: and thanks for your advice. there's definitely
interest in working with the commotion
(01:03:54 PM) tunabananas1: firmware*
(01:04:13 PM) andygunn: Excellent. Folks should hop on the Commotion Dev
list if they have questions about implementation
(01:04:27 PM) andygunn: Do you need the link?
(01:06:05 PM) tunabananas1:
https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/commotion-dev cc legind
(01:06:20 PM) andygunn: Yep, that's it.
(01:06:23 PM) andygunn: Thanks!
(01:07:34 PM) tunabananas1: so we are planning to do some rooftop testing
soon before the weather gets too nice
(01:08:08 PM) tunabananas1: but in crappy conditions what's the range of a
directional ubiquiti antenna
(01:08:09 PM) tunabananas1: ?
(01:08:38 PM) tunabananas1: based on your experience...
(01:08:39 PM) andygunn: Depends on the Antenna
(01:08:51 PM) tunabananas1: DotA
(01:08:58 PM) grady: lol
(01:09:09 PM) andygunn: If you are using a NanoStation M2, about a mile
(01:09:16 PM) andygunn: also depends on interference
(01:09:21 PM) grady: I've found the range on picos goes way down in bad
weather
(01:09:37 PM) andygunn: Yes, omnidirectional units have much less range
(01:09:44 PM) andygunn: about 1000 feet outdoors in clear weather
(01:09:57 PM) andygunn: Also, pure RF range is deceptive
(01:10:11 PM) andygunn: Since low signal may be fine if there is no
interference
(01:10:20 PM) andygunn: but in the presence of interference, your link
quality will go in the crapper
(01:10:32 PM) hawkinsw-laptop: is anyone on a college campus that can help
me with access to jstor?
(01:10:52 PM) andygunn: So for critical links over a long distance, I
recommend using 5GHz equipment
(01:11:05 PM) andygunn: It can bridge to the mesh via Ethernet
(01:11:14 PM) andygunn: With some extra configuration
(01:12:05 PM) andygunn: There is also a question of TCP ack round-trip time
with long links, that I'm not sure is implemented in mesh firmware yet
(01:12:14 PM) andygunn: I was going to start a thread on Commotion Dev
about it
(01:14:29 PM) areynold: I can almost guarantee that Ben is going to be your
best bet in getting that question answered
(01:14:55 PM) tunabananas1: what would the distance range be on 5ghz
equipment?
(01:15:04 PM) andygunn: DotA
(01:15:08 PM) tunabananas1: lol
(01:15:24 PM) andygunn: But for a NanoStation, again a mile or so, maybe
further
(01:15:39 PM) andygunn: If you have very long links there are various
dishes that are made for longer distances
(01:16:08 PM) andygunn: http://www.ubnt.com/airmax#nanobridgem
(01:16:14 PM) andygunn: http://www.ubnt.com/airmax#airgrid
(01:16:31 PM) andygunn: These and other pieces of equipment are more geared
towards point-to-point setups
(01:16:50 PM) andygunn: Or for receiving a more powerful signal from
further away, such as in a "cell tower" style install
(01:16:59 PM) andygunn: Also called Point-to-Multipoint
(01:19:41 PM) grady: I sat in on a two-hour long lecture on setting up
ubiquiti networks at the CTS in Tunis
(01:19:56 PM) grady: I can dig up the notes and send them to you tunabananas
(01:20:17 PM) tunabananas1: that'd be great, grady, thanks! i'm
jenny(a)thepyre.org
(01:20:50 PM) andygunn: Grady - please share that with the field and tech
teams as well
(01:21:03 PM) grady: sure no problem
(01:21:07 PM) andygunn: Thanks
(01:21:30 PM) grady: also, I know a distributor that gives pretty sweet
discounts to non-profits
(01:22:46 PM) andygunn: Distributor of what? Wireless equipment?
(01:22:57 PM) grady: yeah, mostly ubiquiti
(01:23:13 PM) andygunn: Which vendor?
(01:23:20 PM) grady: streakwave
(01:23:39 PM) andygunn: Yea, we don't have an account with them yet, but
probably should
(01:23:48 PM) tunabananas1: haha, wasn't going to mention it but yeah,
equipment is pricey. we're thinking of applying for openitp funding. we're
not a nonprofit, just an amorphous grassroots group atm.
(01:24:46 PM) andygunn: Yep - some of the equipment is pricey, but you
should see the prices for proprietary mesh equipment
(01:25:21 PM) andygunn: It's hilarious:
https://www.tessco.com/products/displayHierarchySkus.do?groupId=595&subgrou…
Hi, who's coming to the mesh meetup?
I'm gonna drop by 5mof on my way back to the east bay, but assuming some
folks will be around, i'll head to sudoroom w/ a dual-band mesh router that
we can install there (or just take apart if we prefer :)
--mark B.
We can swing by later in a car to transport them, but unmounting at night
might be difficult..
On Feb 21, 2013 6:14 PM, "Jenny Ryan" <jenny(a)thepyre.org> wrote:
> We can swing by later in a car to transport them, but unmounting at night
> might be difficult..
> On Feb 21, 2013 4:36 PM, "Miguel Vargas" <unroar(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Let me know if anybody can come by my place any time before the meeting
>> and help me with unmounting and transporting the 3 satellite dishes. I'm
>> about a mile from sudoroom near Fairyland.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 19, 2013 at 11:42 AM, Marc Juul <marcjc(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, Feb 19, 2013 at 3:16 AM, Miguel Vargas <unroar(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > Yea, I am going to need help getting them over there. They need to be
>>> > unmounted from their current locations and it will be a lot of stuff to
>>> > carry. I'm only about a mile from sudoroom and I'm generally available,
>>> > let's try to coordinate this week.
>>>
>>> Sounds good.
>>>
>>> > The usb stick seems like a good simple solution. We could start
>>> looking at
>>> > other designs if we end up needing more performance.
>>>
>>> Yeah. Let's try usb sticks first. Jake suggested that we should try to
>>> test the setup during rain / fog, since water blocks 2.4 ghz. So we
>>> should get this set up as soon as possible (before it stops raining)
>>> or we may get into a situation where we spend the summer setting up
>>> rooftop connections, only to have them all fail when it starts raining
>>> again.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Marc
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mesh mailing list
>> mesh(a)lists.sudoroom.org
>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/mesh
>>
>>
I want to start doing some experiments with roof to roof wifi.
I think it would be a worthwhile to get two portable satellite
antennas with tripods and see what we can get out of them.
With such a minor investment in equipment we will be able test whether
two rooftop locations can connect to each other before we go out and
buy dedicated equipment for installation.
The small direct tv dishes can be had for $15 to $25 on craigslist.
I found the following on craigslist for $35:
*Two satellite dish tripods
*Alignment compass
*Two small satellite dishes
The problem is that it's spread over two locations, one in Hayward and
one in Milpitas.
Are any of you going near Milpitas and/or Hayward this week and would
you have time to pick this up? If not, I can probably go on a field
trip.
If we get this stuff, then we would additionally need:
*Two sets of binoculars (we only need to borrow them)
*One more compass
*Two wifi usb adapters or smaller wifi to ethernet adapters
What would be really amazing is two sets of binoculars with built-in
compasses, but we can do without.
--
Marc Juul
