18 Mar
2019
18 Mar
'19
12:59 p.m.
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history of the Google Doc I linked
to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be out
of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Ironically, people raise the fact that I
haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or
discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria in
order to
speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
18 Mar
18 Mar
1:38 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history of the
Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be out
of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com> wrote:
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
Ironically, people raise the fact that I
haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or
discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria in
order to
speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
19 Mar
19 Mar
1:27 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Guys, I have not been aware of this thread as I've had a major issue that
has now been resolved, but I too completely advocate for Jenny stepping
into this role.
As far as power, paying people when we're all volunteers, etc. there are
some philosophical things we need to work out, (e.g. I'm not going to feel
as good about cleaning the bathroom for free the next time there's a
shitsplosion if I know someone else gets paid to clean it) but in this case
specifically we have a precedent--we have paid lawyers and other
specialists to do things that we needed done well and didn't have
volunteers that were capable of doing them, like we did with Jesse, our
lawyer.
This is temporary, necessary, and I volunteer as an accountability buddy
who will stand up to Jenny if she attempts to become Omni dictator at any
point in the future. Which she will not, and that's why I am advocating so
strongly for her to be able to do this.
L
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring Jenny at
least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be out
of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
Ironically, people raise the fact that I
haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or
discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria in
order to
speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
20 Mar
20 Mar
1:55 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
I feel like I have to chime in.
I understand that there might be mixed feelings about the proposal, but
Jenny has been extremely generous with her time, and I am really surprised
her offer didn't get approved. I understand that there is some conflict
among the collectives but despite this being the case, it does not mean
chores do themselves.
Blocking this movement without any clear path forward as to whom else might
fill this role, is rather silly of us all, especially with tax season
almost upon us.
Now I don't want to be misconstrued as belittling anybody's position, but,
where do we go from here? Saying no is inoperative unless we have an
alternative in place.
On Tue, Mar 19, 2019, 1:30 PM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune(a)gmail.com wrote:
Guys, I have not been aware of this thread as I've
had a major issue that
has now been resolved, but I too completely advocate for Jenny stepping
into this role.
As far as power, paying people when we're all volunteers, etc. there are
some philosophical things we need to work out, (e.g. I'm not going to feel
as good about cleaning the bathroom for free the next time there's a
shitsplosion if I know someone else gets paid to clean it) but in this case
specifically we have a precedent--we have paid lawyers and other
specialists to do things that we needed done well and didn't have
volunteers that were capable of doing them, like we did with Jesse, our
lawyer.
This is temporary, necessary, and I volunteer as an accountability buddy
who will stand up to Jenny if she attempts to become Omni dictator at any
point in the future. Which she will not, and that's why I am advocating so
strongly for her to be able to do this.
L
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
Virus-free.
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
>
> The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
22 Mar
22 Mar
5:54 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Just a quick chime in about precedent for paying people. We have, in the
past, also payed people for doing big show sound setup and teardown as,
again, no one else could step up to doing the job in the pro manner that
was needed, so…
On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 9:30 PM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Guys, I have not been aware of this thread as I've
had a major issue that
has now been resolved, but I too completely advocate for Jenny stepping
into this role.
As far as power, paying people when we're all volunteers, etc. there are
some philosophical things we need to work out, (e.g. I'm not going to feel
as good about cleaning the bathroom for free the next time there's a
shitsplosion if I know someone else gets paid to clean it) but in this case
specifically we have a precedent--we have paid lawyers and other
specialists to do things that we needed done well and didn't have
volunteers that were capable of doing them, like we did with Jesse, our
lawyer.
This is temporary, necessary, and I volunteer as an accountability buddy
who will stand up to Jenny if she attempts to become Omni dictator at any
point in the future. Which she will not, and that's why I am advocating so
strongly for her to be able to do this.
L
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
Virus-free.
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<#m_1959455333579337551_m_-6141615408580316760_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
>
> The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
6:07 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Also, another of my 0.02, the big issue I've heard raised is that this
would somehow give Jenny more power specifically in the GCEA conflict.
Has anyone pointed out that Almaz's nonpayment of promised funds basically
already constitutes us paying her, and paying Jenny therefore doesn't give
her extra status over Almaz, but according to the objectors' logic,
actually makes them more equal?
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 5:54 PM Cere Misc <cere.misc(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Just a quick chime in about precedent for paying
people. We have, in the
past, also payed people for doing big show sound setup and teardown as,
again, no one else could step up to doing the job in the pro manner that
was needed, so…
On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 9:30 PM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune(a)gmail.com> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
Guys, I have not been aware of this thread as
I've had a major issue that
has now been resolved, but I too completely advocate for Jenny stepping
into this role.
As far as power, paying people when we're all volunteers, etc. there are
some philosophical things we need to work out, (e.g. I'm not going to feel
as good about cleaning the bathroom for free the next time there's a
shitsplosion if I know someone else gets paid to clean it) but in this case
specifically we have a precedent--we have paid lawyers and other
specialists to do things that we needed done well and didn't have
volunteers that were capable of doing them, like we did with Jesse, our
lawyer.
This is temporary, necessary, and I volunteer as an accountability buddy
who will stand up to Jenny if she attempts to become Omni dictator at any
point in the future. Which she will not, and that's why I am advocating so
strongly for her to be able to do this.
L
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
Virus-free.
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot <martinot4(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
> thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
> raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
> >
> > The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
> in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
> actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
> criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
> the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
> soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
> the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
> which my name is bandied about.
>
> Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
> you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
> somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
> done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
> consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
> to be the case here.
>
> For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
> full quorum.
> _______________________________________________
> consensus mailing list
> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>
_______________________________________________
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consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
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6:24 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
for the record, event organizers contract directly with omni audio engineers
omni does not pay them
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 6:09 PM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Also, another of my 0.02, the big issue I've heard
raised is that this
would somehow give Jenny more power specifically in the GCEA conflict.
Has anyone pointed out that Almaz's nonpayment of promised funds basically
already constitutes us paying her, and paying Jenny therefore doesn't give
her extra status over Almaz, but according to the objectors' logic,
actually makes them more equal?
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 5:54 PM Cere Misc <cere.misc(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Just a quick chime in about precedent for paying
people. We have, in the
past, also payed people for doing big show sound setup and teardown as,
again, no one else could step up to doing the job in the pro manner that
was needed, so…
On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 9:30 PM Lesley Bell <zvezdalune(a)gmail.com> wrote:
--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
_______________________________________________
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https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
Guys, I have not been aware of this thread as
I've had a major issue
that has now been resolved, but I too completely advocate for Jenny
stepping into this role.
As far as power, paying people when we're all volunteers, etc. there are
some philosophical things we need to work out, (e.g. I'm not going to feel
as good about cleaning the bathroom for free the next time there's a
shitsplosion if I know someone else gets paid to clean it) but in this case
specifically we have a precedent--we have paid lawyers and other
specialists to do things that we needed done well and didn't have
volunteers that were capable of doing them, like we did with Jesse, our
lawyer.
This is temporary, necessary, and I volunteer as an accountability buddy
who will stand up to Jenny if she attempts to become Omni dictator at any
point in the future. Which she will not, and that's why I am advocating so
strongly for her to be able to do this.
L
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
> Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history of the Google Doc I
> linked to in my proposal
>
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
> can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
> would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
> aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
> should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
> collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
> secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
> work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
> tax season is now upon us.
>
> I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
> out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
>
> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot <martinot4(a)gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
>> thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
>> raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
>> >
>> > The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
>> in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
>> actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
>> criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
>> the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
>> soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
>> the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
>> which my name is bandied about.
>>
>> Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
>> you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
>> somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
>> done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
>> consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
>> to be the case here.
>>
>> For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
>> full quorum.
>> _______________________________________________
>> consensus mailing list
>> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
>> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>>
> _______________________________________________
> consensus mailing list
> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>
_______________________________________________
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--
Lesley Bell
432-266-0397
zvezdalune(a)gmail.com
<http://lesleybell.com>
_______________________________________________
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26 Mar
26 Mar
12:48 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
I'm coming late to an awareness of this issue, but I'd like to add that I
support hiring Jenny both temporarily now to get the taxes done (a very
urgent matter at this point!) and in an established role in the future, and
would like to offer my thanks for all the work she's put in gratis already.
I hope we all can bear in mind that the top priority needs to be what's
good for the Omni as a whole, and high on the list of priorities should be
what's fair to the individual members as well.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring Jenny at
least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be out
of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
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Ironically, people raise the fact that I
haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or
discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria in
order to
speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
6:23 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Seems like this block could be over ruled, considering the amount of folks
who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement here?
Thanks for taking the time to advocate for this, everyone. I haven't heard
of a single non-profit that relies entirely on volunteer work for
everything, especially these kinds of very professional specialized tasks,
such as finance, which could wreck the entire boat if done improperly and
carry a ton of weight and responsibility.
It is really shameful and disrespectful for Steve & co to disregard that
effort being put in, and to also go against what seems to be such a clear
and overwhelming support of the proposal.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 2:49 PM Anthony Di Franco <di.franco(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I'm coming late to an awareness of this issue, but
I'd like to add that I
support hiring Jenny both temporarily now to get the taxes done (a very
urgent matter at this point!) and in an established role in the future, and
would like to offer my thanks for all the work she's put in gratis already.
I hope we all can bear in mind that the top priority needs to be what's
good for the Omni as a whole, and high on the list of priorities should be
what's fair to the individual members as well.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
--
Karissa McKelvey
https://okdistribute.xyz
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot
<martinot4(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
>
> The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
which my name is bandied about.
Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
to be the case here.
For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
full quorum.
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
6:25 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Seems like this block could be over ruled, considering the amount of folks
who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement here?
Thanks for taking the time to advocate for this, everyone. I haven't heard
of a single non-profit that relies entirely on volunteer work for
everything, especially these kinds of very professional specialized tasks,
such as finance, which could wreck the entire boat if done improperly and
carry a ton of weight and responsibility.
It is really shameful and disrespectful for Steve & co to disregard that
effort being put in, and to also go against what seems to be such a clear
and overwhelming support of the proposal.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 8:23 PM Karissa McKelvey <karissa.mckelvey(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Seems like this block could be over ruled, considering
the amount of folks
who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement here?
Thanks for taking the time to advocate for this, everyone. I haven't heard
of a single non-profit that relies entirely on volunteer work for
everything, especially these kinds of very professional specialized tasks,
such as finance, which could wreck the entire boat if done improperly and
carry a ton of weight and responsibility.
It is really shameful and disrespectful for Steve & co to disregard that
effort being put in, and to also go against what seems to be such a clear
and overwhelming support of the proposal.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 2:49 PM Anthony Di Franco <di.franco(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I'm coming late to an awareness of this
issue, but I'd like to add that I
support hiring Jenny both temporarily now to get the taxes done (a very
urgent matter at this point!) and in an established role in the future, and
would like to offer my thanks for all the work she's put in gratis already.
I hope we all can bear in mind that the top priority needs to be what's
good for the Omni as a whole, and high on the list of priorities should be
what's fair to the individual members as well.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
--
Karissa McKelvey
https://okdistribute.xyz
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history
of the Google Doc I
linked to in my proposal
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
tax season is now upon us.
I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot <martinot4(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
> thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
> raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
> >
> > The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
> in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
> actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
> criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
> the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
> soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
> the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
> which my name is bandied about.
>
> Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
> you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
> somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
> done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
> consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
> to be the case here.
>
> For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
> full quorum.
> _______________________________________________
> consensus mailing list
> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
11:12 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
I support this message. Sup.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 6:25 PM Karissa McKelvey <krmckelv(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Seems like this block could be over ruled, considering
the amount of folks
who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement here?
Thanks for taking the time to advocate for this, everyone. I haven't heard
of a single non-profit that relies entirely on volunteer work for
everything, especially these kinds of very professional specialized tasks,
such as finance, which could wreck the entire boat if done improperly and
carry a ton of weight and responsibility.
It is really shameful and disrespectful for Steve & co to disregard that
effort being put in, and to also go against what seems to be such a clear
and overwhelming support of the proposal.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 8:23 PM Karissa McKelvey <
karissa.mckelvey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Seems like this block could be over ruled,
considering the amount of
folks who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement
here?
Thanks for taking the time to advocate for this, everyone. I haven't
heard of a single non-profit that relies entirely on volunteer work for
everything, especially these kinds of very professional specialized tasks,
such as finance, which could wreck the entire boat if done improperly and
carry a ton of weight and responsibility.
It is really shameful and disrespectful for Steve & co to disregard that
effort being put in, and to also go against what seems to be such a clear
and overwhelming support of the proposal.
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 2:49 PM Anthony Di Franco <di.franco(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
I'm coming late to an awareness of this
issue, but I'd like to add that
I support hiring Jenny both temporarily now to get the taxes done (a very
urgent matter at this point!) and in an established role in the future, and
would like to offer my thanks for all the work she's put in gratis already.
I hope we all can bear in mind that the top priority needs to be what's
good for the Omni as a whole, and high on the list of priorities should be
what's fair to the individual members as well.
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:38 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
--
Karissa McKelvey
https://okdistribute.xyz
Steve, Julian, would you agree to Omni hiring
Jenny at least to do this
year's taxes? In my opinion, there is zero chance to hire a CPA who has as
much background knowledge of the Omni's finances and would be willing to do
it for as low a fee as she is charging.
Jenny had suggested a trial period anyway. We can revisit the issue of
hiring her permanently afterwards.
Patrik
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
Virus-free.
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On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:01 PM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
> Re: Timing - A quick glance at the edit history of the Google Doc I
> linked to in my proposal
>
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pZwwjGPjsCryp78dySTHFbrmiTZR-Q5FqQf82S5eTpk/edit#>
> can demonstrate that I've been writing it since last October, knowing I
> would need to start generating my household's income this year and acutely
> aware of how much time Omni's bookkeeping work has taken in the past. It
> should be noted I'm essentially doing the bookkeeping for not one, but 6
> collectives (Omni writ large, Sudo, LibLens, partial DIY [they have a
> secondary fiscal sponsor as well], The Village [a significant amount of
> work], and BAPS [tho they contributed $0 in 2019 and have no expenses]) and
> tax season is now upon us.
>
> I am unable to attend the Delegate's Meeting this Thursday as I'll be
> out of town, but happy to answer any questions or concerns remotely.
>
> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:56 AM Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 6:58 AM Steve Martinot <martinot4(a)gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Ironically, people raise the fact that I haven't responded to this
>> thread. But I didn't see any responses or discussion concerning what I
>> raised in my last two emails. I guess some people like to have it both ways.
>> >
>> > The suggestion has been made that I should fulfill certain criteria
>> in order to speak (like shoeing up for meetings that I'm not sure will
>> actually occur). If that is the case, then please give me the full list of
>> criteria I need to meet in order to speak (when I feel like speaking), with
>> the source or foundation for the items on the list. That way, some brave
>> soul can tell me to shut the fuck up if I don't fulfill all the terms of
>> the list. At least, that is the logic of some of the statements made in
>> which my name is bandied about.
>>
>> Steve, who's telling you not to speak? Quite the opposite, I'm asking
>> you to say something substantial about the issue of paying Jenny (or
>> somebody else) to do Omni's bookkeeping, which IIRC you still haven't
>> done, and which I think should be a bare minimum requirement in a
>> consensus process where you're the only person blocking, which appears
>> to be the case here.
>>
>> For the record, the past 3 delegates meetings have had full or nearly
>> full quorum.
>> _______________________________________________
>> consensus mailing list
>> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
>> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>>
> _______________________________________________
> consensus mailing list
> consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
>
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11:15 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 6:23 PM Karissa McKelvey <karissa.mckelvey(a)gmail.com wrote:
Seems like this block could be over ruled, considering
the amount of folks
who have jumped on board in support. Looking like over 95% agreement here?
It might be useful to remind folks that by the Omni Commons Bylaws
<https://omnicommons.org/wiki/Bylaws#SECTION_14._MAJORITY_ACTION_AS_BOARD_ACTION>,
the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be making
a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall back on if we
start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork done...
Patrik
27 Mar
27 Mar
8:42 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It might be useful to remind folks that by the Omni
Commons Bylaws, the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be making
a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall back on if we start to run
out of time to get our tax paperwork done...
Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
*legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
have to.
Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
28 Mar
28 Mar
10:14 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
this block is just so fucked. agree with using all currently available
means allowed in bylaws to authorize payment for clearly below market
rate professional services. has BAPS offered any sort of counter
proposal or are we just tasked with looking in the mirror at what could
be wrong with ourselves and finding the tax answers there?
On 2019-03-27 8:42 pm, Yardena Cohen wrote:
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik
D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
It might be useful to remind folks that by the
Omni Commons Bylaws,
the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be
making a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall
back on if we start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork
done...
Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
*legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
have to.
Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
_______________________________________________
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sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
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31 Mar
31 Mar
1:45 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
Evidently the plan is to "find an intern" to do it all.
Best of luck with that.
On Thu, Mar 28, 2019, 11:14 <hol(a)gaskill.com> wrote:
this block is just so fucked. agree with using all
currently available
means allowed in bylaws to authorize payment for clearly below market
rate professional services. has BAPS offered any sort of counter
proposal or are we just tasked with looking in the mirror at what could
be wrong with ourselves and finding the tax answers there?
On 2019-03-27 8:42 pm, Yardena Cohen wrote:
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik
D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
It might be useful to remind folks that by the
Omni Commons Bylaws,
the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be
making a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall
back on if we start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork
done...
Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
*legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
have to.
Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
11:04 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
according to who?
it would cost way more $ to get someone else to do it
& if our MO is hiring outside ppl instead of paying our volunteers, i'll
quit volunteering
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 1:45 AM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
Evidently the plan is to "find an intern" to
do it all.
Best of luck with that.
On Thu, Mar 28, 2019, 11:14 <hol(a)gaskill.com> wrote:
this block is just so fucked. agree with using
all currently available
means allowed in bylaws to authorize payment for clearly below market
rate professional services. has BAPS offered any sort of counter
proposal or are we just tasked with looking in the mirror at what could
be wrong with ourselves and finding the tax answers there?
On 2019-03-27 8:42 pm, Yardena Cohen wrote:
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik
D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
It might be useful to remind folks that by the
Omni Commons Bylaws,
the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be
making a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall
back on if we start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork
done...
Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
*legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
have to.
Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
11:29 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
I think the more salient part of Julian's counter proposal is to get a 6mo
extension on our taxes, which should give us enough time to focus on the
GCEA mediation first.
And if Julian thinks he can recruit a free intern to help out with the
bookkeeping, I don't see anything wrong with that. As long as we don't
spend *more* effort training an intern plus doing the books...
Patrik
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 11:05 AM robb <sf99er(a)gmail.com> wrote:
according to who?
it would cost way more $ to get someone else to do it
& if our MO is hiring outside ppl instead of paying our volunteers, i'll
quit volunteering
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 1:45 AM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
Evidently the plan is to "find an
intern" to do it all.
Best of luck with that.
On Thu, Mar 28, 2019, 11:14 <hol(a)gaskill.com> wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
this block is just so fucked. agree with using
all currently available
means allowed in bylaws to authorize payment for clearly below market
rate professional services. has BAPS offered any sort of counter
proposal or are we just tasked with looking in the mirror at what could
be wrong with ourselves and finding the tax answers there?
On 2019-03-27 8:42 pm, Yardena Cohen wrote:
_______________________________________________
consensus mailing list
consensus(a)lists.omnicommons.org
https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/consensus
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik
D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> It might be useful to remind folks that by the Omni Commons Bylaws,
> the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be
> making a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall
> back on if we start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork
> done...
Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
*legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
have to.
Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
11:40 a.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
srry still haven't had time to read Julian's book
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 11:29 AM Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I think the more salient part of Julian's counter
proposal is to get a 6mo
extension on our taxes, which should give us enough time to focus on the
GCEA mediation first.
And if Julian thinks he can recruit a free intern to help out with the
bookkeeping, I don't see anything wrong with that. As long as we don't
spend *more* effort training an intern plus doing the books...
Patrik
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 11:05 AM robb <sf99er(a)gmail.com> wrote:
according to who?
it would cost way more $ to get someone else to do it
& if our MO is hiring outside ppl instead of paying our volunteers, i'll
quit volunteering
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 1:45 AM Jenny Ryan <jenny(a)jennyryan.net> wrote:
Evidently the plan is to "find an
intern" to do it all.
Best of luck with that.
On Thu, Mar 28, 2019, 11:14 <hol(a)gaskill.com> wrote:
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
this block is just so fucked. agree with using
all currently available
means allowed in bylaws to authorize payment for clearly below market
rate professional services. has BAPS offered any sort of counter
proposal or are we just tasked with looking in the mirror at what could
be wrong with ourselves and finding the tax answers there?
On 2019-03-27 8:42 pm, Yardena Cohen wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:16 PM Patrik D'haeseleer <
patrikd(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> It might be useful to remind folks that by the Omni Commons Bylaws,
>> the board can legally act by a majority vote. Not that we should be
>> making a habit out of that, but it might be a useful option to fall
>> back on if we start to run out of time to get our tax paperwork
>> done...
>
> Not only that, but we'd already given the finance working group a lot
> of leeway and discretion in the past, to the point where I think
> *legally* they could have just decided to pay Jenny without asking for
> consensus. The fact that they did ask is a good thing, but they didn't
> have to.
>
> Which makes the accusations about people "wanting to run a
> corporation" really stink. It's a cheap shot. The corporate form is
> forced on us by circumstance, and we've been trying hard to run an
> anarchist collective simultaneously, in parallel. If anybody really
> wanted a hostile takeover, it would have happened by now.
> _______________________________________________
> sudo-discuss mailing list
> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
https://sudoroom.org/lists/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
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3:27 p.m.
New subject: [omni-consensus] Proposal: Hire or Replace Me as Omni's Bookkeeper
On 3/31/19, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I think the more salient part of Julian's counter
proposal is to get a 6mo
extension on our taxes, which should give us enough time to focus on the
GCEA mediation first.
There's no reason to believe Jenny's proposal will still be valid in
six months. It is almost certain that she will have had to seek other
employment. Nor does Omni's accounting consist of a single lump of
work done once a year. It is continuous work that cannot not be paused
for six months.
And if Julian thinks he can recruit a free intern to
help out with the
bookkeeping, I don't see anything wrong with that. As long as we don't
spend *more* effort training an intern plus doing the books...
You'd be asking someone to work for free to replace themselves with
someone else who we hope will continue working for free indefinitely
or long enough to train their replacement. That's after putting in a
bunch of labor to train them. For anyone with experience running a
volunteer-based organization this is an obvious recipe for failure.
Julian and Steve's original complaint that this proposal will somehow
put Jenny in a position of more power has been thoroughly rebutted by
multiple people and they have still not addressed that their only
stated reason for blocking the proposal is invalid. Everything else
from their side is hand-wavy complaints about elitism and racism but
with no concrete examples of this behavior ever materializing, nor how
it's related to this proposal.
They are blocking without engaging in good faith toward a resolution
around the reason for their block. As such their block is invalid and
we can move on without them. If they at that point come up with some
previously unstated new reason for their block then it's mighty
suspicious that they waited to bring it up until then, and again it
would be obvious that they're not interested in working in good faith
with the rest of Omni community.
The only new thing to come out of Julian's last email is this:
The issue is that if the delegates decide to validate
one party while invalidating another, we are setting mediation up to fail by setting it up
on a biased basis from the get go.
and what a load of bullshit. Of _course_ the mediation is biased from
the get go. People have made decisions and followed them up with
actions and the rest of the community have formed opinions and made
decisions based on those actions. This is how reality works. Does he
think his blocking is doing anything to prevent that? If anything it
has done the exact opposite by putting this in the spotlight and
eliciting statements of support for Jenny's proposal from many members
of many collectives.
Thinking that a block from two guys calling themselves a collective is
somehow going to unbias the upcoming mediation requires some serious
mental gymnastics, to the point where you have to start questioning
the motive.
Julian's blocking is either terribly misguided or actively malicious
and I am beginning to consider whether he and Steve are now seeking to
get their collective kicked out in order to walk away with some
perceived moral high-ground. They have at this point generated enough
animosity towards their collective-of-two that I cannot imagine
staying would be pleasant for anyone involved. They have backed
themselves into a corner and losing their collective status may be
their least painful remaining option.
--
marc/juul
1853
days inactive
1866
days old
18 comments
13 participants
participants (13)
-
Adam -
Anthony Di Franco -
Cere Misc -
hol＠gaskill.com -
Jae Kwon -
Jenny Ryan -
Karissa McKelvey -
Karissa McKelvey -
Lesley Bell -
Marc Juul -
Patrik D'haeseleer -
robb -
Yardena Cohen