15 Jan
2015
15 Jan
'15
5:34 p.m.
To add my voice to the discussion:
- The incidents in this case should not be kept secret but told publicly to
the list. Not that anyone is advancing this, but this should not be a
closed session thing - elliot is part of more communities than sudo, so
lets have the mediator but the circumstances should be public. I don't
think Elliot would object to that.
- May I ask, has elliot already been formally warned against any of this
behavior, or not? It would be good to know.
- It should be noted that in at least 3 of the incidents I know about at
least over the last couple years, the genesis of the incident was Elliot's
attempt to act to protect space and community around him, albiet in an
badly escalating way that I agree is definitely something that has to stop.
Nonetheless I think the intent and circumstance are germane.
For example (to the best of my knowledge here):
The first incident I'm aware of was an altercation with an individual who
if I recall correctly was already banned from another collective, RPS, due
to safe space issues.
In the second instance our landlord back at 2141 set off a bug bomb while
people were working in the space and Elliot forcibly removed it outside.
In the second instance someone jimmied open the door with knife, called
jenny a bitch and had to be escorted out. (This guy had disrupted public
school classes in the past and is a verified creep.)
In the third instance, I hear elliot thought a new sudo applicant (someone
not yet well known in our community) was stealing. Prior to the
altercation, at least one sudo organizer formally expressed concern for
this new member's mental/emotional state. From what I understand its not
clear whether the individual was stealing or not, but I believe this should
be taken into account.
Basically for all elliots faults I do see elliot as someone who actually
tries to protect the space and those around him and I feel that this
information is missing from the conversation about preserving safe space. I
believe intent is not irrelevant and to elliot's mind, I am pretty sure, he
is trying to keep the safe space, not make it less safe. That he does so in
a reckless way is bad but the pattern to me seems to be elliot being
overprotective and escalating.
A caveat is most of my information is second-hand, but I felt such
circumstances are germane.
David
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 4:53 PM, <hol(a)gaskill.com> wrote:
from sudo room articles:
Section 2.3 Benefits
The following are benefits available to all members:
- Usable assets and resources
<https://sudoroom.org/wiki/Articles_of_Association/Assets_and_Resources>
available within reasonable constraints of time and under the condition of
sharing.
- *sudo room* strives to make assets and resources available to as
many non-member participants and beneficiaries as possible.
- Note: no personal property should be stored in *sudo room* unless
a system for personal storage can be provided by *sudo room*.
- Note: the use of *sudo room* environments for habitation and/or
domestic use is strongly discouraged.
- Approved discounts and services negotiated through the collective
purchasing power of *sudo room*.
- Items are up to the discretion of *sudo room* to determine
through its budgeting and decision-making processes.
- A *safe space,* which is defined as:
- "A place where anyone can relax and be fully self-expressed,
without fear of being made to feel uncomfortable, unwelcome, or unsafe on
account of biological sex, race/ethnicity, sexual orientation, gender
identity or expression, cultural background, age, or physical or mental
ability; a place where the rules guard each person's self-respect and
dignity and strongly encourage everyone to respect others." —
Advocates for Youth via Wikipedia
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safe-space>.
- A place free of physical violence or threats thereof.
On 2015-01-15 16:21, Stephen Novotny wrote:
yes. I think this is it
https://omnicommons.org/wiki/Safer_Space_Policy#4..E2.80.8E_.E2.80.8FConseq…
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 4:18 PM, Karissa McKelvey <krmckelv(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
There needs to be clear guidelines surrounding
who can access the
commons otherwise the commons deteriorates.
If someone breaks a rule, they should be subject to consequences.
Is there no policy guideline surrounding physical violence in this
commons??
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 1:50 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
This is
not be
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Hey all,
I am regularly moved by the sudo room community's compassion.
However, allow me to re-iterate a selection of my original message,
facts
and my personal positions that have not changed:
> this is the second time in our new location (I was present the first
time)
> ... of Elliot escalating a situation to a
physical, even violent,
response
on his
part.
We must differentiate patterns of behavior from isolated incidents. a pattern, and I think it reasonable to
anticipate the risk of repeat
behavior.
greater
I am no longer willing to tolerate this behavior
Nor do I believe anyone should.
> [Elliot's continued participation is] ... a greater cost, and even potential
risk, than a revocation of his privilege to use the space.
Consequences are hard to deal with, but we, as individuals, must hold
ourselves and each other responsible for our actions.
It has become more and more obvious to me that when individuals take
advantage of their access to the commons, it is most critical for our
community to act as stewards, to show resolve that such behavior will tolerated, and that paths to reconciliation begin
with recognizing
that, if
necessary, the privilege to access the commons
can, and will, be taken
away.
// Matt
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 1:44 PM, Jenny Ryan <tunabananas(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>
> The path forward for those interested in pursuing this issue is to put
it
> on the sudoroom meeting agenda, and show up
prepared to discuss a
proposal.
> No one involved in this issue was present at
the sudo room meeting last
> night. In all honesty we could really use more participation in those
> meetings by regular members other than Marc, myself and Matt.
>
> Thanks,
> Jenny
>
> On 01/15/2015 11:51 AM, Eske Silver wrote:
> > Thanks for the comments, and update.
> > Hopefully we'll figure out how to go about finding a solution for
this.
> >
> > ~ Korl
> >
> > 500px.com/eske
> > 510.689.4484
> > On Jan 15, 2015 11:47 AM, "Ryan" <yandoryn(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Nothing was brought up at the meeting.
> > > On Jan 15, 2015 11:47 AM, "Ryan" <yandoryn(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> > >
> > >> I fully support that with no edits, korl. I think it is full of
> > >> compassion and care for everyone.
> > >> On Jan 15, 2015 11:44 AM, "Eske Silver"
<eske.silver(a)gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Sent this a couple days go, but I forgot to hit 'reply
all':
> > >>>
> > >>> True, though, that we have parted ways with members, and guests,
for
> > >>> less than [multiple
physical incidents?] - comrade or not.
> > >>> While case-by-case is my prefered language, I also always stand
by a
> > >>> Zero Tolerance for abuse
toward another loving being.
> > >>>
> > >>> From what I've read, this seems the logical mean answer:
> > >>> For the sake of Safer Spaces, let's ask that Elliot appreciate
a
> > >>> request
> > >>> that they take leave, until we find a resolution...
> > >>> For the sake of nuance and case-by-case, I'd bet we could find
> > >>> someone
> > >>> who's known Elliot for a handful of human time increments, who
would
> > >>> be so
> > >>> kind as to reach out to Elliot. This person might then glean
what's
> > >>> going
> > >>> on with Elliot, and how he feels we (all) should/can procede with
> > >>> these
> > >>> issues.
> > >>> Then, for the sake of precident, if Elliot is willing and able,
we
>
>>> can
> >>> follow the guide and set on to conflict resolution...
> >>> The rest is (in theory) easy, I'd say.
> >>>
> >>> Any edits?
> >>>
> >>> ~ Korl
> >>>
> >>> ~ Korl
> >>>
> >>> 500px.com/eske
> >>> 510.689.4484
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> discuss mailing list
> >>> discuss(a)lists.omnicommons.org
> >>> https://omnicommons.org/lists/listinfo/discuss
> >>>
> >>>
>
>
>
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--
Jenny
http://jennyryan.net
http://sudomesh.org
http://thevirtualcampfire.org
http://technomadic.tumblr.com
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"Technology is the campfire around which we tell our stories."
-Laurie Anderson
"Storytelling reveals meaning without committing the error of defining
it."
-Hannah Arendt
"To define is to kill. To suggest is to create."
-Stéphane Mallarmé
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