Re: [sudo-discuss] IRC

Here's a proposal. Assume that #sudoroom on FreeNode should be officially operated by

Assume that FreeNode will force the transfer of +F to whoever/whatever

Assume that SudoRoom agrees that the contents of #sudoroom should be

Then I suggest we: (0) test the assumptions first. (a) vote on whether +F should be reassigned, and if so, (b) vote to whom +F should go, where candidates are suggested -- real

On Jan 30, 2013, at 2:26 PM, hol(a)gaskill.com wrote: > bumping rachel's sentiment here. yardena's note here was the clearest

> > > Jan 30, 2013 01:15:46 PM, rachelyra(a)gmail.com wrote: > i think this reply is dismissive and it makes me sadfaced. >> >> Yardena is talking about much deeper and more insidious, and

>> divisive, issues than typos or spelling. If you think her concerns are >> boring, then you could easily ignore them and stay silent without being >> dismissive and rude. >> >> Yardena did an awesome job of facilitating meetings for 6 straight

>> last week... it seems to me like anyone who enjoyed that experience

>> her might take a moment to give a damn about her concerns. >> >> Multiple folks have suggested it would be good to have a clear IRC >> policy. That seems like a good next step. Maybe a wiki page, seeded >> with Yardena 's suggestion here? I am not active on the channel so am >> not sure if it makes sense for me to be too involved in that

>> >> R. >> >> On 1/30/2013 1:07 PM, Clarence Beeks wrote: >>> Do you know why America is awesome? We have the time and privilege

>>> resources to argue >>> over replacing a "Y" with a "J". >>> >>> I can 't wait for the next comet. >>> >>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Yardena Cohen yardenack(a)gmail.com >>> mailto:yardenack@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>>>> Apparently the Sudo folk with admin privileges to the #sudoroom >>> IRC channel are jealously resistant to sharing control, >>> >>>> This is not the case. Jordana and Tunabananas have operator >>> privileges and can perform any sort of moderation they desire. If >>> you have an issue with the content of #sudoroom, creating a new >>> channel will not solve that problem. >>> >>> I avoided replying to this right away, because I was too angry and >>> creeped out over being called "Jordana." He did this once before in >>> the IRC while at the same time talking about me with male pronouns >>> (he/his) - he knows better, so I took this as targeted harassment,

>>> at the very least disingenuous passive aggressive participation in

>>> trolling games that have been going on lately. He 's apologized to

>>> in private since then but I just want to register that joking about >>> hackerspace wars can be fun, but actually gaslighting each other is >>> NOT fun. It can be scary, intimidating, and seriously compromise the >>> accessibility and diversity of our community. >>> >>> As to the substance, he 's absolutely right that we have op

>>> but this obscures a few things. For technical background, I

>>> people to read about the difference between +F and +o. Your best

>>> will be logging onto freenode and typing: "/msg chanserv help flags" >>> but more general guides are online: >>> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Modes >>> https://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml >>> >>> There 've been conflicts over how to run the channel. Namely: >>> >>> 1) The person with +F has used his privileges to override the >>> decisions of those with only +o, at several times unquieting people >>> we 've quieted. The contexts for these were admittedly

>>> and fall on ideological fault lines over how to run an IRC channel

>>> general, so I agree 100% with Andrew that a clear IRC policy is the >>> way to go. For the record, this has been mostly about using

>>> slurs, and my position has been not to tolerate them very much. We >>> happen to have in our community a person who makes it his life 's

>>> to push peoples ' buttons with slurs, and happened to be doing

>>> the IRC channel. He 'd also made a habit of typing anatomical

>>> random times. Form your own opinions. Again, the solution to this

>>> be more about having a clear policy, than who enforces it. >>> >>> 2) The person with +F has acted in bad faith. He flooded the channel >>> with ascii art of an ejaculating swastika and claimed it was an >>> "accident", which would be a no-brainer kban in most any channel.

>>> asked to share +F with other people, his response was to vandalize

>>> Sudoroom wiki to say he is the "leader" ( >>> http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Community_Structure ). In the meantime, he >>> shares +F with a friend of his who hadn 't been to Sudoroom since >>> summer 2012 and didn 't even seem to know anybody 's name. They

>>> set the +S (successor) flag for a person who is emphatically NOT a >>> Sudoroom member and has even publically criticized Sudoroom. This

>>> a clear message to the rest of us that we were dealing with people

>>> saw us as a joke; didn 't respect our community; and that there was >>> little we could do about it in the short term. That mistrust has >>> colored all of the talk over IRC privileges since then, and has only >>> escalated since these same people came to our 1/16 meeting and made

>>> significantly longer (by complaining about the meeting being long!), >>> and also filled our meeting agenda notes with things like "fuck", >>> "poop" and "this is why you guys never hack anything". >>> >>> I 'm not bitter or anything, just trying to bring out some of the >>> subtext here for those not following why things are happening the

>>> they are. >>> >>> I think the best formulation for IRC rules that everyone can agree

>>> would be something like: we want the IRC channel to accurately

>>> the atmosphere at the physical sudoroom space. To me, that nicely >>> encompasses all the many behavioral problems and general do 's and >>> don 'ts. Honestly the room itself has rarely had the kind of

>>> the channel has, because people tend to be a lot more decent to each >>> other face to face, and because it self-selects for people who care >>> about the community. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> sudo-discuss mailing list >>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org mailto:

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