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sign yourselves up to the new Art Murmur mailing list:
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/artmurmur
Thanks,
Tracy
When founder status has been abused to the point of revoking the decisions
of operators, behaving inappropriately with insulting symbols, and
intimidating one of our most awesomely proactive members (which Yardena
described most acutely and all of which I have been witness to), then it
would seem Founder status is indeed required to be held by someone the
community trusts.
Jenny
http://jennyryan.nethttp://thepyre.orghttp://thevirtualcampfire.orghttp://technomadic.tumblr.com
`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
"Technology is the campfire around which we tell our stories."
-Laurie Anderson
"Storytelling reveals meaning without committing the error of defining it."
-Hannah Arendt
"To define is to kill. To suggest is to create."
-Stéphane Mallarmé
~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`
On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 3:47 PM, Mischa Spiegelmock
<thadwooster(a)gmail.com>wrote:
> Founder status is not required to "filter" the content of the channel
>
> On Jan 30, 2013, at 3:46 PM, Jae Kwon wrote:
>
> > Here's a proposal.
> >
> > Assume that #sudoroom on FreeNode should be officially operated by
> SudoRoom the collective. [assumption 1]
> > Assume that FreeNode will force the transfer of +F to whoever/whatever
> SudoRoom decides. [assumption 2]
> > Assume that SudoRoom agrees that the contents of #sudoroom should be
> filtered for the purpose of SafeSpace. [assumption 3]
> >
> > Then I suggest we:
> >
> > (0) test the assumptions first.
> > (a) vote on whether +F should be reassigned, and if so,
> > (b) vote to whom +F should go, where candidates are suggested -- real
> bot implementations included.
> >
> > On Jan 30, 2013, at 2:26 PM, hol(a)gaskill.com wrote:
> >
> >> bumping rachel's sentiment here. yardena's note here was the clearest
> explanation I've seen, as someone who doesn't really get on the IRC channel
> and who would like this information to get out prior to the meeting so as
> to reduce meeting time.
> >>
> >>
> >> Jan 30, 2013 01:15:46 PM, rachelyra(a)gmail.com wrote:
> >> i think this reply is dismissive and it makes me sadfaced.
> >>>
> >>> Yardena is talking about much deeper and more insidious, and
> potentially
> >>> divisive, issues than typos or spelling. If you think her concerns are
> >>> boring, then you could easily ignore them and stay silent without being
> >>> dismissive and rude.
> >>>
> >>> Yardena did an awesome job of facilitating meetings for 6 straight
> hours
> >>> last week... it seems to me like anyone who enjoyed that experience
> with
> >>> her might take a moment to give a damn about her concerns.
> >>>
> >>> Multiple folks have suggested it would be good to have a clear IRC
> >>> policy. That seems like a good next step. Maybe a wiki page, seeded
> >>> with Yardena 's suggestion here? I am not active on the channel so am
> >>> not sure if it makes sense for me to be too involved in that
> process...?
> >>>
> >>> R.
> >>>
> >>> On 1/30/2013 1:07 PM, Clarence Beeks wrote:
> >>>> Do you know why America is awesome? We have the time and privilege
> and
> >>>> resources to argue
> >>>> over replacing a "Y" with a "J".
> >>>>
> >>>> I can 't wait for the next comet.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Yardena Cohen yardenack(a)gmail.com
> >>>> mailto:yardenack@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>> Apparently the Sudo folk with admin privileges to the #sudoroom
> >>>> IRC channel are jealously resistant to sharing control,
> >>>>
> >>>>> This is not the case. Jordana and Tunabananas have operator
> >>>> privileges and can perform any sort of moderation they desire. If
> >>>> you have an issue with the content of #sudoroom, creating a new
> >>>> channel will not solve that problem.
> >>>>
> >>>> I avoided replying to this right away, because I was too angry and
> >>>> creeped out over being called "Jordana." He did this once before in
> >>>> the IRC while at the same time talking about me with male pronouns
> >>>> (he/his) - he knows better, so I took this as targeted harassment,
> or
> >>>> at the very least disingenuous passive aggressive participation in
> the
> >>>> trolling games that have been going on lately. He 's apologized to
> me
> >>>> in private since then but I just want to register that joking about
> >>>> hackerspace wars can be fun, but actually gaslighting each other is
> >>>> NOT fun. It can be scary, intimidating, and seriously compromise the
> >>>> accessibility and diversity of our community.
> >>>>
> >>>> As to the substance, he 's absolutely right that we have op
> privileges,
> >>>> but this obscures a few things. For technical background, I
> encourage
> >>>> people to read about the difference between +F and +o. Your best
> guide
> >>>> will be logging onto freenode and typing: "/msg chanserv help flags"
> >>>> but more general guides are online:
> >>>>
> >>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Modes
> >>>> https://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml
> >>>>
> >>>> There 've been conflicts over how to run the channel. Namely:
> >>>>
> >>>> 1) The person with +F has used his privileges to override the
> >>>> decisions of those with only +o, at several times unquieting people
> >>>> we 've quieted. The contexts for these were admittedly
> controversial
> >>>> and fall on ideological fault lines over how to run an IRC channel
> in
> >>>> general, so I agree 100% with Andrew that a clear IRC policy is the
> >>>> way to go. For the record, this has been mostly about using
> oppressive
> >>>> slurs, and my position has been not to tolerate them very much. We
> >>>> happen to have in our community a person who makes it his life 's
> work
> >>>> to push peoples ' buttons with slurs, and happened to be doing
> that IN
> >>>> the IRC channel. He 'd also made a habit of typing anatomical
> words at
> >>>> random times. Form your own opinions. Again, the solution to this
> may
> >>>> be more about having a clear policy, than who enforces it.
> >>>>
> >>>> 2) The person with +F has acted in bad faith. He flooded the channel
> >>>> with ascii art of an ejaculating swastika and claimed it was an
> >>>> "accident", which would be a no-brainer kban in most any channel.
> When
> >>>> asked to share +F with other people, his response was to vandalize
> the
> >>>> Sudoroom wiki to say he is the "leader" (
> >>>> http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Community_Structure ). In the meantime, he
> >>>> shares +F with a friend of his who hadn 't been to Sudoroom since
> >>>> summer 2012 and didn 't even seem to know anybody 's name. They
> 'd also
> >>>> set the +S (successor) flag for a person who is emphatically NOT a
> >>>> Sudoroom member and has even publically criticized Sudoroom. This
> sent
> >>>> a clear message to the rest of us that we were dealing with people
> who
> >>>> saw us as a joke; didn 't respect our community; and that there was
> >>>> little we could do about it in the short term. That mistrust has
> >>>> colored all of the talk over IRC privileges since then, and has only
> >>>> escalated since these same people came to our 1/16 meeting and made
> it
> >>>> significantly longer (by complaining about the meeting being long!),
> >>>> and also filled our meeting agenda notes with things like "fuck",
> >>>> "poop" and "this is why you guys never hack anything".
> >>>>
> >>>> I 'm not bitter or anything, just trying to bring out some of the
> >>>> subtext here for those not following why things are happening the
> way
> >>>> they are.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think the best formulation for IRC rules that everyone can agree
> on
> >>>> would be something like: we want the IRC channel to accurately
> reflect
> >>>> the atmosphere at the physical sudoroom space. To me, that nicely
> >>>> encompasses all the many behavioral problems and general do 's and
> >>>> don 'ts. Honestly the room itself has rarely had the kind of
> problems
> >>>> the channel has, because people tend to be a lot more decent to each
> >>>> other face to face, and because it self-selects for people who care
> >>>> about the community.
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org mailto:
> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org>
> >>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > sudo-discuss mailing list
> > sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> > http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>
> _______________________________________________
> sudo-discuss mailing list
> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>
Just wanted to advertise that I had it as an option.
I didn't write any direct control into the bot thus far. But the thing
about a bot is that the community could control it. It could, without
emotion, act on the IRC policies we program it to know.
-Wolfy
On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 1:44 PM, David Rorex <drorex(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> How is the bot any better than using the built in ChanServ features?
> And don't you end up with the same problem of deciding who gets to
> control the bot?
>
> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 1:33 PM, Matthew Meier <wolfy(a)wlfy.it> wrote:
> > I've also written an IRC bot in python. super basic that can ops people
> from
> > a list. It works with server messages directly too so i can write it to
> > perform any other actions that would be beneficial to our IRC channel and
> > policy.
> >
> > Just throwing that out there.
> >
> > -Wolfy
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate(a)gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> OKAY, I've added some more to the conflict resolution item on our agenda
> >> tonight: https://pad.riseup.net/p/sudoroom
> >>
> >> // Matt
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 1:15 PM, rachel lyra hospodar
> >> <rachelyra(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> i think this reply is dismissive and it makes me sadfaced.
> >>>
> >>> Yardena is talking about much deeper and more insidious, and
> potentially
> >>> divisive, issues than typos or spelling. If you think her concerns are
> >>> boring, then you could easily ignore them and stay silent without being
> >>> dismissive and rude.
> >>>
> >>> Yardena did an awesome job of facilitating meetings for 6 straight
> hours
> >>> last week... it seems to me like anyone who enjoyed that experience
> with her
> >>> might take a moment to give a damn about her concerns.
> >>>
> >>> Multiple folks have suggested it would be good to have a clear IRC
> >>> policy. That seems like a good next step. Maybe a wiki page, seeded
> with
> >>> Yardena's suggestion here? I am not active on the channel so am not
> sure if
> >>> it makes sense for me to be too involved in that process...?
> >>>
> >>> R.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 1/30/2013 1:07 PM, Clarence Beeks wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Do you know why America is awesome? We have the time and privilege
> and
> >>>> resources to argue
> >>>> over replacing a "Y" with a "J".
> >>>>
> >>>> I can't wait for the next comet.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Yardena Cohen <yardenack(a)gmail.com
> >>>> <mailto:yardenack@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> >> Apparently the Sudo folk with admin privileges to the
> #sudoroom
> >>>> IRC channel are jealously resistant to sharing control,
> >>>>
> >>>> > This is not the case. Jordana and Tunabananas have operator
> >>>> privileges and can perform any sort of moderation they desire. If
> >>>> you have an issue with the content of #sudoroom, creating a new
> >>>> channel will not solve that problem.
> >>>>
> >>>> I avoided replying to this right away, because I was too angry and
> >>>> creeped out over being called "Jordana." He did this once before
> in
> >>>> the IRC while at the same time talking about me with male pronouns
> >>>> (he/his) - he knows better, so I took this as targeted harassment,
> >>>> or
> >>>> at the very least disingenuous passive aggressive participation in
> >>>> the
> >>>> trolling games that have been going on lately. He's apologized to
> me
> >>>> in private since then but I just want to register that joking
> about
> >>>> hackerspace wars can be fun, but actually gaslighting each other
> is
> >>>> NOT fun. It can be scary, intimidating, and seriously compromise
> the
> >>>> accessibility and diversity of our community.
> >>>>
> >>>> As to the substance, he's absolutely right that we have op
> >>>> privileges,
> >>>> but this obscures a few things. For technical background, I
> >>>> encourage
> >>>> people to read about the difference between +F and +o. Your best
> >>>> guide
> >>>> will be logging onto freenode and typing: "/msg chanserv help
> flags"
> >>>> but more general guides are online:
> >>>>
> >>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Modes
> >>>> https://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml
> >>>>
> >>>> There've been conflicts over how to run the channel. Namely:
> >>>>
> >>>> 1) The person with +F has used his privileges to override the
> >>>> decisions of those with only +o, at several times unquieting
> people
> >>>> we've quieted. The contexts for these were admittedly
> controversial
> >>>> and fall on ideological fault lines over how to run an IRC channel
> >>>> in
> >>>> general, so I agree 100% with Andrew that a clear IRC policy is
> the
> >>>> way to go. For the record, this has been mostly about using
> >>>> oppressive
> >>>> slurs, and my position has been not to tolerate them very much. We
> >>>> happen to have in our community a person who makes it his life's
> >>>> work
> >>>> to push peoples' buttons with slurs, and happened to be doing that
> >>>> IN
> >>>> the IRC channel. He'd also made a habit of typing anatomical words
> >>>> at
> >>>> random times. Form your own opinions. Again, the solution to this
> >>>> may
> >>>> be more about having a clear policy, than who enforces it.
> >>>>
> >>>> 2) The person with +F has acted in bad faith. He flooded the
> channel
> >>>> with ascii art of an ejaculating swastika and claimed it was an
> >>>> "accident", which would be a no-brainer kban in most any channel.
> >>>> When
> >>>> asked to share +F with other people, his response was to vandalize
> >>>> the
> >>>> Sudoroom wiki to say he is the "leader" (
> >>>> http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Community_Structure ). In the meantime,
> he
> >>>> shares +F with a friend of his who hadn't been to Sudoroom since
> >>>> summer 2012 and didn't even seem to know anybody's name. They'd
> also
> >>>> set the +S (successor) flag for a person who is emphatically NOT a
> >>>> Sudoroom member and has even publically criticized Sudoroom. This
> >>>> sent
> >>>> a clear message to the rest of us that we were dealing with people
> >>>> who
> >>>> saw us as a joke; didn't respect our community; and that there was
> >>>> little we could do about it in the short term. That mistrust has
> >>>> colored all of the talk over IRC privileges since then, and has
> only
> >>>> escalated since these same people came to our 1/16 meeting and
> made
> >>>> it
> >>>> significantly longer (by complaining about the meeting being
> long!),
> >>>> and also filled our meeting agenda notes with things like "fuck",
> >>>> "poop" and "this is why you guys never hack anything".
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm not bitter or anything, just trying to bring out some of the
> >>>> subtext here for those not following why things are happening the
> >>>> way
> >>>> they are.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think the best formulation for IRC rules that everyone can agree
> >>>> on
> >>>> would be something like: we want the IRC channel to accurately
> >>>> reflect
> >>>> the atmosphere at the physical sudoroom space. To me, that nicely
> >>>> encompasses all the many behavioral problems and general do's and
> >>>> don'ts. Honestly the room itself has rarely had the kind of
> problems
> >>>> the channel has, because people tend to be a lot more decent to
> each
> >>>> other face to face, and because it self-selects for people who
> care
> >>>> about the community.
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >>>> <mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org>
> >>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >>> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> sudo-discuss mailing list
> >> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> >> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > sudo-discuss mailing list
> > sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> > http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
> >
>
>> Apparently the Sudo folk with admin privileges to the #sudoroom IRC channel are jealously resistant to sharing control,
> This is not the case. Jordana and Tunabananas have operator privileges and can perform any sort of moderation they desire. If you have an issue with the content of #sudoroom, creating a new channel will not solve that problem.
I avoided replying to this right away, because I was too angry and
creeped out over being called "Jordana." He did this once before in
the IRC while at the same time talking about me with male pronouns
(he/his) - he knows better, so I took this as targeted harassment, or
at the very least disingenuous passive aggressive participation in the
trolling games that have been going on lately. He's apologized to me
in private since then but I just want to register that joking about
hackerspace wars can be fun, but actually gaslighting each other is
NOT fun. It can be scary, intimidating, and seriously compromise the
accessibility and diversity of our community.
As to the substance, he's absolutely right that we have op privileges,
but this obscures a few things. For technical background, I encourage
people to read about the difference between +F and +o. Your best guide
will be logging onto freenode and typing: "/msg chanserv help flags"
but more general guides are online:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Modeshttps://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml
There've been conflicts over how to run the channel. Namely:
1) The person with +F has used his privileges to override the
decisions of those with only +o, at several times unquieting people
we've quieted. The contexts for these were admittedly controversial
and fall on ideological fault lines over how to run an IRC channel in
general, so I agree 100% with Andrew that a clear IRC policy is the
way to go. For the record, this has been mostly about using oppressive
slurs, and my position has been not to tolerate them very much. We
happen to have in our community a person who makes it his life's work
to push peoples' buttons with slurs, and happened to be doing that IN
the IRC channel. He'd also made a habit of typing anatomical words at
random times. Form your own opinions. Again, the solution to this may
be more about having a clear policy, than who enforces it.
2) The person with +F has acted in bad faith. He flooded the channel
with ascii art of an ejaculating swastika and claimed it was an
"accident", which would be a no-brainer kban in most any channel. When
asked to share +F with other people, his response was to vandalize the
Sudoroom wiki to say he is the "leader" (
http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Community_Structure ). In the meantime, he
shares +F with a friend of his who hadn't been to Sudoroom since
summer 2012 and didn't even seem to know anybody's name. They'd also
set the +S (successor) flag for a person who is emphatically NOT a
Sudoroom member and has even publically criticized Sudoroom. This sent
a clear message to the rest of us that we were dealing with people who
saw us as a joke; didn't respect our community; and that there was
little we could do about it in the short term. That mistrust has
colored all of the talk over IRC privileges since then, and has only
escalated since these same people came to our 1/16 meeting and made it
significantly longer (by complaining about the meeting being long!),
and also filled our meeting agenda notes with things like "fuck",
"poop" and "this is why you guys never hack anything".
I'm not bitter or anything, just trying to bring out some of the
subtext here for those not following why things are happening the way
they are.
I think the best formulation for IRC rules that everyone can agree on
would be something like: we want the IRC channel to accurately reflect
the atmosphere at the physical sudoroom space. To me, that nicely
encompasses all the many behavioral problems and general do's and
don'ts. Honestly the room itself has rarely had the kind of problems
the channel has, because people tend to be a lot more decent to each
other face to face, and because it self-selects for people who care
about the community.
hey all,
as discussed at last week's meeting, we are hoping to have a sewing
hackathon on sunday, February 10th. we talked about 1-4pm, but I heard
LOLspace is having its anniversary party on that day around 3pm, so I am
wondering if people want to have our sewing party on a different day, or
earlier so we can head over to LOLspace too?
i am proposing 12-3pm instead! thoughts?
also, how does one become endowed with the powers to add events to the
calendar? or alternately, where does one submit events for the calendar?
all hail sudo!
R.
Oakland Art Murmur First Friday is this Friday, Feb. 1.
In order to facilitate planning and discussion for this and upcoming Art
Murmurs - a new Sudo Room listserv has been created. If you would like to
help out, are an artist that wants to display stuff, or are just interested
in keeping full track of what's going on, please subscribe at the link
below. Today.
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/artmurmur
We will keep the sudo-discuss listserv updated on major changes and
announcements, but will otherwise focus all displayed art related energy
and information on the Art Murmur listserv.
Sent from eddan.com
--
sent from Eddan.com
Hey folks,
I wanted to ask the list if there would be any issues with myself and a
couple of my friends using a wall in the common area to colab on visuals
stuffs tomorrow night?
I know there are some meetings happening tomorrow, but we would be
relatively quiet. We're just experimenting with how to best coordinate
visuals with a couple projectors and possibly test out some projection
mapping stuff which requires a bit more space than I have in my apartment.
I understand it could be visually distracting and I don't want to step on
any toes so please let me know if anyone feels this would be encroaching on
the meetings already in place.
Thoughts?
Thanks in advance,
Jack
SUDO announce to list -get excited,
sudo shroom is rapidly progressing. We're going to grow oyster and shiitake
mushrooms in sudoroom, to 1) get some delicious mushrooms, 2) master the
growing process, 3) in the future experiement with creating grow kits,
water treatment and more.
We're on the verge of bringing in the simple gear we need. We've got spores
and growing mediums ready. It's going to be an explosion awesome cultures!
Let us know if you want to join.
Our wiki home: http://sudoroom.org/wiki/Sudoshroom
Make a great day,
Morten
