as long as it's only to fool a pin on the controller that should be fine. are you familiar with rotary phase converters? i looked into this issue a while back when i was foolishly considering purchasing a bridgeport mill and it came up on the forums as the best thing for big 3 phase inductive loads. i'll have to look at those pdfs you posted to get up to speed on the specs for the motors themselves. big props to really getting in there and hacking this thing jake, definitely above what i would have ever bitten off. cheers On 2014-08-20 15:33, Jake wrote: I think the balcony breaker has plenty of power, it's got 200A x 230V service from the other breaker, and we'll never use even 50A total ever. as for the robot power, I figured out how to fake out the third phase, using a 1666 ohm resistor and a 10uF capacitor, because I don't actually need the third phase for power, only to fool the motor controllers into thinking power is there. the motor controllers are just rectifying the AC into DC so it doesn't matter whether there are three legs of AC or only two (which we have) I agree that we should run 230v to the shop area, which we need for the robot anyway. Other appliances (welders and stuff) can just share the circuit. -jake On Mon, 18 Aug 2014, hol(a)gaskill.com wrote: do y'all know what the rated amperage to the balcony panel is? i thought i had it but i only have the label numbers in the document i was thinking of. might be good to run 230V over to the shop area too. for the robot's 3-phase power, they do make rotary phase converters which seem to be commonplace for switching between single phase and 3 phase, basically a single phase motor with a 3 phase genset http://modesto.craigslist.org/tls/4619369559.html i am stoked about electrical upgrades - do y'all know if anyone is working on ventilation too? david was thinking for one area of running a blower as the first stage up into one of the existing roof-mounted exhaust fans. if we can get 230V and exhaust in the shop corner we are in serious business. cheers On 2014-08-17 21:31, Jake wrote: Hi Whit, Sorry I didn't write back to your previous post! I am super glad you're here, your skills are exactly what is needed. I would say that you have more experience running pipe an d wire and installing outlets than I do, so I will call you the lead on making this happen. I looked at the attached PDF (I hope you saw the spreadsheet I made too) and I think that your map is very complete. I had been thinking of about half as many outlets, but you are right to suggest we do the job right the first time, rather than rush ing to get it done. That said, if we find ways to leave some outlets for later (after the upcoming fire inspection) we should keep in mind that the priority right now is to eliminate use of extensi on cords, and do so ASAP. We can always add more service later. As for service levels, I believe the standard 20 amp breaker for each leg of outlets (shared by two boxes of two duplex sockets each) will be plenty for all outlets. we will no t be running more than one 20A circuit worth of servers or anything else, and the only high-power users are temporary things like occasional power tools. About the robot: the breaker labeled for it (in the middle on the right, at the balcony panel) is connected right now! you can see the wire running down to its control box. I t is "temporary" but has been very important in working on the robot to figure out what we need next. I would like for us to add service (red black white and green) to the area you listed as "Plug J" for the robot, since it will be located there according to consensus. The buil ding does not have 3-phase power though, so I will be doing some electronics magic to make the thing run anyway. I looked into the hanging outlets phenomenon (the ceiling beams are pretty high in sudoroom) and I don't think we should hang extension cords.. are you familiar with the "correc t" way to make power drops? I believe one is supposed to use twist-lok cord-mounted sockets on tension-rated cords, grabbed by special strain reliefs when they leave the juncti on boxes high up. Then one can make regular outlet boxes with twist-lok plugs to connect to the hanging service.. but i really don't know what's "right". Anyway, since you're the lead on this project, please let us (sudoroom and the omni) know what your budget is (consider editing the spreadsheet I made) and when you are availabl e to start. Also, please tell us how many helpers you want and when, and what skills are desirable. I volunteer myself both for electrical work (i do have those skills) and for helping coordinate other volunteers. I can also help get supplies, when we know exactly what to get . After we complete the installation, we will hire a professional electrician to inspect our work and sign off on it, so we can be partially reimbursed by the landlord. thank you -jake 415-533-3699 On Sun, 17 Aug 2014, Whitney Lawrence wrote: Jake,I understand you are the Lead for the electric install. Please look at the attached .pdf, I made a first pass on the locations of outlets. I think we should use the 3 free breaker spaces in the Balcony breaker box, in addition to the abandoned "marquee" breaker. Looking at the front of the Sub-panel above the stage it looks like the plan is to power the robot arm directly from there, with a 30A breaker. Also we need to figure out the plan for the conduit runs after the outlet type and locations are finalized. We will need volunteers to help with prepping the space for install (moving shelving etc away from walls), and for doing the installation. Let me know what else I can do to get power to the people! The draft should be reviewed by everyone to be sure we are planning for all needs. For example- what are the immediate power needs for the server? Can we build in the potential for up-sizing? Similarly for the robot arm- where will it be located? It requires 3phase 240 correct? Thanks, Whit