5 May
2013
5 May
'13
5:16 p.m.
Just a reminder that the archives of this list are indexed by Google.
(For this reason I'm keeping pretty quiet here. Would anyone else like to
have a list which is not indexed? How about "sudo-ephemeral"?)
-Rabbit
5 May
5 May
7:06 p.m.
Rabbit & Yo's-
Here's another vote for "yes we should have a list that's not indexed by
Google."
Given the choice between posting to a list that's a direct
surveillance-feed and one that isn't, many of us will take our
discussion to the latter. (Would you rather cuddle with your friends
under a surveillance camera, or under a tree?)
But let's not call it "ephemeral," because that word, in this context,
is a white flag of surrender. It's surrender to the idea that Google is
the one and only keeper of cultural memory, and anything else is merely
transient. It's surrender to corporate power and the control state.
We should assert the right to our own collective memory, stored on our
own devices, accessible to our own community. The place for the kind of
broadcast that becomes an appetizer on Big Brother's cannibal menu, is
when the broadcast is something that'll give Big Brother indigestion.
Let Google eat our manifestos, proclamations, and press releases. But
not our soul-searches, our occasional bickering, our existential angst,
or our vulnerable self-revealing philosophizing about sex, religion, and
the meaning of life.
-G.
=====
On 13-05-05-Sun 5:16 PM, Rabbit wrote:
Just a reminder that the archives of this list are
indexed by Google.
(For this reason I'm keeping pretty quiet here. Would anyone else
like to have a list which is not indexed? How about "sudo-ephemeral"?)
-Rabbit
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
10:20 p.m.
We should be clear that the part of our collective memory that is made
publicly searchable by Google et. al. is only a slice of the feast on Big
Brother's cannibal menu:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/04/telephone-calls-recorde…
BURNETT: Tim, is there any way, obviously, there is a voice mail they can
try to get the phone companies to give that up at this point. It's not a
voice mail. It's just a conversation. There's no way they actually can find
out what happened, right, unless she tells them?
CLEMENTE: "No, *there is a way. We certainly have ways in national security
investigations to find out exactly what was said in that conversation.* It's
not necessarily something that the FBI is going to want to present in
court, but it may help lead the investigation and/or lead to questioning of
her. We certainly can find that out.
BURNETT: "So they can actually get that? People are saying, look, that is
incredible.
CLEMENTE: "No, *welcome to America. All of that stuff is being captured as
we speak whether we know it or like it or not*."
"All of that stuff" - meaning every telephone conversation Americans have
with one another on US soil, with or without a search warrant - "is being
captured as we speak"
On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 7:06 PM, GtwoG PublicOhOne <g2g-public01(a)att.net>wrote;wrote:
Rabbit & Yo's-
Here's another vote for "yes we should have a list that's not indexed by
Google."
Given the choice between posting to a list that's a direct
surveillance-feed and one that isn't, many of us will take our discussion
to the latter. (Would you rather cuddle with your friends under a
surveillance camera, or under a tree?)
But let's not call it "ephemeral," because that word, in this context, is
a white flag of surrender. It's surrender to the idea that Google is the
one and only keeper of cultural memory, and anything else is merely
transient. It's surrender to corporate power and the control state.
We should assert the right to our own collective memory, stored on our own
devices, accessible to our own community. The place for the kind of
broadcast that becomes an appetizer on Big Brother's cannibal menu, is when
the broadcast is something that'll give Big Brother indigestion.
Let Google eat our manifestos, proclamations, and press releases. But not
our soul-searches, our occasional bickering, our existential angst, or our
vulnerable self-revealing philosophizing about sex, religion, and the
meaning of life.
-G.
=====
On 13-05-05-Sun 5:16 PM, Rabbit wrote:
Just a reminder that the archives of this list are indexed by Google.
(For this reason I'm keeping pretty quiet here. Would anyone else like
to have a list which is not indexed? How about "sudo-ephemeral"?)
-Rabbit
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing
listsudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.orghttp://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
6 May
6 May
12:40 a.m.
Anthony & Yo's-
Big Brother's cannibal menu is large, so there's no shortage of places
to remove ourselves from it. Whether or not it's possible to remove
ourselves from all of it at once, isn't a good reason to declare
pre-emptive surrender and give up all hope and all resistance.
The FBI can prosecute you for crimes, but you can cross-examine them in
court, in front of a jury. But what happens when you get turned down
for a job, or an apartment, or a mortgage, or credit, because of
something in your online "profiles"? The Bradley Mannings and Aaron
Swartzes of the world are seen by many as heroes, whose struggles become
causes. But the unemployed and homeless of the world are seen as
"losers," whose struggles are attributed to their own personal failings
rather than the logical result of the oppressive grinding of the gears
of oligarchy.
More and more, employment applications and even credit applications are
decided on the basis of "profiles," aka dossiers, that the privatized
control-state collects on each and every one of us with our every
mouse-click and typed word.
Which consequence is more likely to happen to any of us or anyone else
we know? That they'll become a political cause? or that they'll become
an economic casualty? How many people have been dragged off to Gitmo,
vs. how many have been fired and foreclosed or evicted?
The fear of Gitmo is like the fear of being in an airplane crash: a
horror to be sure, but a highly unlikely event. But the fear of
unemployment and homelessness is so pervasive it's like the stink of
garbage for someone who lives next to a landfill: it's in the air we
breathe to the point where we almost don't bother commenting on it.
None the less it lingers in the background, stinking up our homes and
clothes, interfering with the taste of our food, causing a constant
low-level headache to the point where popping aspirin seems like the
normal state of affairs.
The private-sector Stasi, the private control-state, is where the power
is, and where the power is actually used, on a mass scale that impacts
millions of lives including each of our own.
As for "every telephone conversation," why do you think I'm trying to
build an alternative telco? The mason works with concrete, the
carpenter works with wood, the plumber works with water pipes, the
electrician works with wires, and the roofer works with shingles. Each
by themselves can't build the whole house, but all of them working
together, can.
-G.
=====
On 13-05-05-Sun 10:20 PM, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
We should be clear that the part of our collective
memory that is made
publicly searchable by Google et. al. is only a slice of the feast on
Big Brother's cannibal menu:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/04/telephone-calls-recorde…
BURNETT: Tim, is there any way, obviously, there is a voice mail
they can try to get the phone companies to give that up at this
point. It's not a voice mail. It's just a conversation. There's no
way they actually can find out what happened, right, unless she
tells them?
CLEMENTE: "No, /there is a way. We certainly have ways in national
security investigations to find out exactly what was said in that
conversation./ It's not necessarily something that the FBI is
going to want to present in court, but it may help lead the
investigation and/or lead to questioning of her. We certainly can
find that out.
BURNETT: "So they can actually get that? People are saying, look,
that is incredible.
CLEMENTE: "No, /welcome to America. All of that stuff is being
captured as we speak whether we know it or like it or not/."
"All of that stuff" - meaning every telephone conversation Americans
have with one another on US soil, with or without a search warrant -
"is being captured as we speak"
On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 7:06 PM, GtwoG PublicOhOne
<g2g-public01(a)att.net <mailto:g2g-public01@att.net>> wrote:
Rabbit & Yo's-
Here's another vote for "yes we should have a list that's not
indexed by Google."
Given the choice between posting to a list that's a direct
surveillance-feed and one that isn't, many of us will take our
discussion to the latter. (Would you rather cuddle with your
friends under a surveillance camera, or under a tree?)
But let's not call it "ephemeral," because that word, in this
context, is a white flag of surrender. It's surrender to the idea
that Google is the one and only keeper of cultural memory, and
anything else is merely transient. It's surrender to corporate
power and the control state.
We should assert the right to our own collective memory, stored on
our own devices, accessible to our own community. The place for
the kind of broadcast that becomes an appetizer on Big Brother's
cannibal menu, is when the broadcast is something that'll give Big
Brother indigestion.
Let Google eat our manifestos, proclamations, and press releases.
But not our soul-searches, our occasional bickering, our
existential angst, or our vulnerable self-revealing philosophizing
about sex, religion, and the meaning of life.
-G.
=====
On 13-05-05-Sun 5:16 PM, Rabbit wrote:
Just a reminder that the archives of this
list are indexed by Google.
(For this reason I'm keeping pretty quiet here. Would anyone
else like to have a list which is not indexed? How about
"sudo-ephemeral"?)
-Rabbit
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org <mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org>
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
<mailto:sudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.org>
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
12:50 a.m.
*SHORT VERSION:*
*
*
i expected public when i signed up and see these discussions, primarily, as
a resource that will have been found to bear its sweetest fruit by virtue,
yes, of it's having been mined -- but by the People who share this Lively
Stage, not the Creeping, and Creepy, Evil Spy Creeps.
*
*
*LONG VERSION:*
as a child of the Early Modern period, may i show a solidarity i would not
have expected, quite frankly: i am squarely on the side of make it
searchable. usually i try to more fanatical about privacy as a rule, than
wherever i left off, because i know more would be better. never a
facebook, waiting for nym-support to click at that g-plus with *someone
else's* mouse, nonetheless here i tippy-tap to gmail, as has been recently
brought to my embarrassed attention.
but:
so much of this age is ephemeral. so much of our wisdom is going to be
lost. it is frightening, really. in that way, i hope the spooks make some
hard copy on acid free paper in permanent ink....
because:
i have gotten such good, such wisdom and inspiration, from similar
archives, when they turn up in answer to some search of mine....
unless there is a risk factor i am not taking seriously enough, such as,
this makes it easier for my gmail to become a zombie server of 'American
Idol' action figure brand sugar snacks...
i am rather fond, as well, of the public and searcheable nature of this
record of our lives.
it is (as far as i am aware) the first such list that i have participated
in in the digital world (i ran a couple of Amateur Press Associations, or
APAs, back in their heyday at the dawn of the internet, that event that a
before which cannot be conceived)...
not counting dumb ass go-nowhere google groups and that facebook page that
is STILL stealing one of my poems.
but i digress. and conclude. be seeing you.
On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 10:20 PM, Anthony Di Franco <di.franco(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
We should be clear that the part of our collective
memory that is made
publicly searchable by Google et. al. is only a slice of the feast on Big
Brother's cannibal menu:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/04/telephone-calls-recorde…
BURNETT: Tim, is there any way, obviously, there is a voice mail they can
try to get the phone companies to give that up at this point. It's not a
voice mail. It's just a conversation. There's no way they actually can find
out what happened, right, unless she tells them?
CLEMENTE: "No, *there is a way. We certainly have ways in national
security investigations to find out exactly what was said in that
conversation.* It's not necessarily something that the FBI is going to
want to present in court, but it may help lead the investigation and/or
lead to questioning of her. We certainly can find that out.
BURNETT: "So they can actually get that? People are saying, look, that is
incredible.
CLEMENTE: "No, *welcome to America. All of that stuff is being captured
as we speak whether we know it or like it or not*."
"All of that stuff" - meaning every telephone conversation Americans have
with one another on US soil, with or without a search warrant - "is being
captured as we speak"
On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 7:06 PM, GtwoG PublicOhOne <g2g-public01(a)att.net>wrote;wrote:
Rabbit & Yo's-
Here's another vote for "yes we should have a list that's not indexed by
Google."
Given the choice between posting to a list that's a direct
surveillance-feed and one that isn't, many of us will take our discussion
to the latter. (Would you rather cuddle with your friends under a
surveillance camera, or under a tree?)
But let's not call it "ephemeral," because that word, in this context, is
a white flag of surrender. It's surrender to the idea that Google is the
one and only keeper of cultural memory, and anything else is merely
transient. It's surrender to corporate power and the control state.
We should assert the right to our own collective memory, stored on our
own devices, accessible to our own community. The place for the kind of
broadcast that becomes an appetizer on Big Brother's cannibal menu, is when
the broadcast is something that'll give Big Brother indigestion.
Let Google eat our manifestos, proclamations, and press releases. But
not our soul-searches, our occasional bickering, our existential angst, or
our vulnerable self-revealing philosophizing about sex, religion, and the
meaning of life.
-G.
=====
On 13-05-05-Sun 5:16 PM, Rabbit wrote:
Just a reminder that the archives of this list are indexed by Google.
(For this reason I'm keeping pretty quiet here. Would anyone else like
to have a list which is not indexed? How about "sudo-ephemeral"?)
-Rabbit
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing
listsudo-discuss@lists.sudoroom.orghttp://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
4249
days inactive
4249
days old
4 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
Anthony Di Franco -
GtwoG PublicOhOne -
johanna faust -
Rabbit