25 Apr
2013
25 Apr
'13
6:50 a.m.
one thing i learned from sitting in the biohacking group was that
(biohacking) patrick established a rule that they would have a "working"
meeting, not a socializing meeting, with more emphasis on managing time
wisely and getting things done.
i thought that was a cool approach.
i personally like talking a lot at meetings, socializing but i realize my
extroverted style isn't respectful of other styles
perhaps we could experiment, do some "working" get things done quickly
meetings with a minimum on longer speeches?
25 Apr
25 Apr
7:51 a.m.
for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking meeting or a meeting
where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P one
thing that we discussed on the retreat was whether it was clear that this
was the purpose of the meeting and whether we were really doing it. we've
been experimenting with different formats for our meeting and will continue
to experiment until we hit on something that both accomplishes what we need
to get done (as defined by the articles:
https://sudoroom.org/wiki/page/Articles_of_Association) and is not
extremely time consuming and sad (these are the twin goals people!).
- marina
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 6:50 AM, Romy Ilano <romy(a)snowyla.com> wrote:
one thing i learned from sitting in the biohacking
group was that
(biohacking) patrick established a rule that they would have a "working"
meeting, not a socializing meeting, with more emphasis on managing time
wisely and getting things done.
i thought that was a cool approach.
i personally like talking a lot at meetings, socializing but i realize my
extroverted style isn't respectful of other styles
perhaps we could experiment, do some "working" get things done quickly
meetings with a minimum on longer speeches?
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
8:33 a.m.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking
meeting or a meeting
where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at, at
the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards having
a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every last
friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
get any of the boring logistics done.
"General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've started
calling
them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
automatically self-select accordingly.
Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more free-form,
and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to those! ;-)
Patrik
10:07 a.m.
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time blocks
so people can come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso
<marina.kukso(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking
meeting or a meeting
where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at, at
the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards having
a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every last
friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
get any of the boring logistics done.
"General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've started
calling
them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
automatically self-select accordingly.
Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more free-form,
and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to those! ;-)
Patrik
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
5:06 p.m.
You still need to define "working on what", otherwise you end up having
to waste a lot of time defining that in the moment.
General meetings still need structure, otherwise people lose sight of them
having any purpose and they tend to expand in scope and time length
geometrically.
I still think sudo room would do fine simply splitting out Bureaucracy
and the current general meeting, which actually runs quite well most of the
time.
On Thursday, April 25, 2013, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time blocks
so people can come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer
<patrikd@gmail.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'patrikd(a)gmail.com');>
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso
<marina.kukso@gmail.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'marina.kukso(a)gmail.com');>
> wrote:
>
>> for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking meeting or a meeting
>> where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
>> if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
>>
>
> Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at,
> at the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards
> having a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
>
> We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every
> last friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
> exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
> building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
> get any of the boring logistics done.
>
> "General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've
started calling
> them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
> meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
> wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
> think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
> people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
> automatically self-select accordingly.
>
> Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more free-form,
> and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to those! ;-)
>
> Patrik
>
> _______________________________________________
> sudo-discuss mailing list
> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
> 'sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org');>
> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>
>
9:19 p.m.
I do like the format of one general meeting a month (to discuss all sudo
room goings on) and then the other three meetings can be working/learning
meetings. Maybe with a 15-30 min talk of something of interest so that
we're all learning and sharing.
Patrik suggested the split between general meeting and working meeting and
it's helped us to slice up our time a little bit better to dive into
different topics/subjects. I have really enjoyed Sudo rooms recent
experiments with meeting formats though (I'm finding them more interesting
and more valuable personally).
R
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi(a)gmail.com> wrote:
You still need to define "working on what",
otherwise you end up having
to waste a lot of time defining that in the moment.
General meetings still need structure, otherwise people lose sight of them
having any purpose and they tend to expand in scope and time length
geometrically.
I still think sudo room would do fine simply splitting out Bureaucracy
and the current general meeting, which actually runs quite well most of the
time.
On Thursday, April 25, 2013, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
--
Ryan Bethencourt
Tel: (415) 794 6463
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com
www.bamh1.com
www.linkedin.com/in/bethencourt
www.logos-press.com/books/biotechnology_business_development.php
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time blocks
so people can come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso
<marina.kukso(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking
meeting or a meeting
where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at,
at the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards
having a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every
last friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
get any of the boring logistics done.
"General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've
started
calling them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
automatically self-select accordingly.
Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more
free-form, and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to
those! ;-)
Patrik
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
26 Apr
26 Apr
1:43 a.m.
Yeah, I have to say that I enjoy the recent meetings too. they're getting
more creative, people are eating more...
i brought up considering an introverted person focus / working meeting as I
was hearing people saying they weren't that into it, it's important to
listen! as many things get done during meetings.
meetings serve people who are extroverts (like me), who like to talk and
socialize a lot with many new faces...
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 9:19 PM, Ryan Bethencourt <
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I do like the format of one general meeting a month
(to discuss all sudo
room goings on) and then the other three meetings can be working/learning
meetings. Maybe with a 15-30 min talk of something of interest so that
we're all learning and sharing.
Patrik suggested the split between general meeting and working meeting and
it's helped us to slice up our time a little bit better to dive into
different topics/subjects. I have really enjoyed Sudo rooms recent
experiments with meeting formats though (I'm finding them more interesting
and more valuable personally).
R
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi(a)gmail.com> wrote:
You still need to define "working on
what", otherwise you end up having
to waste a lot of time defining that in the moment.
General meetings still need structure, otherwise people lose sight of
them having any purpose and they tend to expand in scope and time length
geometrically.
I still think sudo room would do fine simply splitting out Bureaucracy
and the current general meeting, which actually runs quite well most of the
time.
On Thursday, April 25, 2013, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
--
Ryan Bethencourt
Tel: (415) 794 6463
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com
www.bamh1.com
www.linkedin.com/in/bethencourt
www.logos-press.com/books/biotechnology_business_development.php
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time
blocks so people can come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso
<marina.kukso(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
> for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking meeting or a meeting
> where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because
> if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
>
Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at,
at the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards
having a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every
last friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
get any of the boring logistics done.
"General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've
started
calling them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
automatically self-select accordingly.
Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more
free-form, and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to
those! ;-)
Patrik
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
1:53 p.m.
TL;DR -- please don't try to solve reticence to attend meetings with more
meetings of any kind.
Introverts have limited social energy, and if they have spent any time
thinking about this, they will realize that it has to be metered carefully.
http://www.myersbriggs.org/my-mbti-personality-type/mbti-basics/extravert-a…
Extroverts tend to feel that more social time is always justified, which is
why meetings tend to expand in all situations where extroverts outnumber
introverts -- which is basically most of the time in an organizational
setting... except perhaps in libraries and hackerspaces :)
The greater the number of extroverts, the more the extroverts socialize and
feel that this time is productive, which creates more demand for more
meetings, which makes the introverts feel unproductive and marginalized.
Corporations tend to have a disproportionate number of ESTJs
(extroverted-sensing-thinking-judging) types. This was covered in a paper
circa 1999 (I need to find it again, I wrote a paper referencing it),
wherein they found that as corporations grow from small to medium to large,
the diversity of personality types dramatically decreases, especially in
positions of power. Specifically (with arrows indicating greater weight
towards a skewed ratio):
E/I -->> E
S/N --> S
T/F --> T
J/P -->> J
There are of course problems with the MBTI, well-discussed in an episode of
Rationally Speaking a few months back, and also some covered on this page
(which is also a podcast):
http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4221
...but even if it lacks predictive power, its use as a descriptive tool to
look at broad patterns is still somewhat respectable.
I think it's interesting that the "managerial type", ESTJ, appears
consistent at least across American and Chinese cultures, which helps
address the "isn't this Western-cultural specific" complaint:
https://www.capt.org/JPT/article/JPT_Vol69_1209.pdf
Introverts also tend not to speak up in opposition to what extroverts are
doing, for obvious reasons. They prefer to withdraw and spend time on
things that recharge their social energy.
The point:
* Extroverts feel energized from social encounters and want more of them;
introverts feel drained by social encounters and try to avoid them.
* Extroverts tend to "select" other extroverts for participation, believing
they are just better team players.
* Introverts tend to be penalized for their unwillingness to participate in
social encounters, leading to a more skewed proportion of extroverts to
introverts as introverts become marginalized.
Conclusion:
* You can't solve meeting reticence with more meetings.
--Naomi, the "I can pretend to be an extrovert sometimes" introvert, INTP
On Fri, Apr 26, 2013 at 1:43 AM, Romy Ilano <romy(a)snowyla.com> wrote:
Yeah, I have to say that I enjoy the recent meetings
too. they're getting
more creative, people are eating more...
i brought up considering an introverted person focus / working meeting as
I was hearing people saying they weren't that into it, it's important to
listen! as many things get done during meetings.
meetings serve people who are extroverts (like me), who like to talk and
socialize a lot with many new faces...
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 9:19 PM, Ryan Bethencourt <
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com> wrote:
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
I do like the format of one general meeting a
month (to discuss all sudo
room goings on) and then the other three meetings can be working/learning
meetings. Maybe with a 15-30 min talk of something of interest so that
we're all learning and sharing.
Patrik suggested the split between general meeting and working meeting
and it's helped us to slice up our time a little bit better to dive into
different topics/subjects. I have really enjoyed Sudo rooms recent
experiments with meeting formats though (I'm finding them more interesting
and more valuable personally).
R
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi(a)gmail.com> wrote:
You still need to define "working on
what", otherwise you end up having
to waste a lot of time defining that in the moment.
General meetings still need structure, otherwise people lose sight of
them having any purpose and they tend to expand in scope and time length
geometrically.
I still think sudo room would do fine simply splitting out Bureaucracy
and the current general meeting, which actually runs quite well most of the
time.
On Thursday, April 25, 2013, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
--
Ryan Bethencourt
Tel: (415) 794 6463
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com
www.bamh1.com
www.linkedin.com/in/bethencourt
www.logos-press.com/books/biotechnology_business_development.php
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time
blocks so people can come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
>
>> for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking meeting or a
>> meeting where business relating to the functioning of the group gets done?
>> because if it means the latter, then our meeting is supposed to be that :P
>>
>
> Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is
> at, at the moment. But as long as we're making significant progress towards
> having a functioning DIYbio lab, it's all good.
>
> We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every
> last friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions,
> exchanging cool ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for
> building a community, but if we only have that kind of meetings, we'd never
> get any of the boring logistics done.
>
> "General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've
started
> calling them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
> meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we
> wanted it small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I
> think as long as we advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that
> people will be expected to contribute and get something done, they will
> automatically self-select accordingly.
>
> Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more
> free-form, and not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to
> those! ;-)
>
> Patrik
>
> _______________________________________________
> sudo-discuss mailing list
> sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>
>
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
5:41 p.m.
Ok, as usual this is getting pretty complicated. I was just wondering if there is a DIY
Bio meeting tonight at the Sudo Room?
Thanks,
Tracy
On Apr 26, 2013, at 1:43 AM, Romy Ilano <romy(a)snowyla.com> wrote:
Yeah, I have to say that I enjoy the recent meetings
too. they're getting more creative, people are eating more...
i brought up considering an introverted person focus / working meeting as I was hearing
people saying they weren't that into it, it's important to listen! as many things
get done during meetings.
meetings serve people who are extroverts (like me), who like to talk and socialize a lot
with many new faces...
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 9:19 PM, Ryan Bethencourt <ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I do like the format of one general meeting a month (to discuss all sudo room goings on)
and then the other three meetings can be working/learning meetings. Maybe with a 15-30 min
talk of something of interest so that we're all learning and sharing.
Patrik suggested the split between general meeting and working meeting and it's
helped us to slice up our time a little bit better to dive into different topics/subjects.
I have really enjoyed Sudo rooms recent experiments with meeting formats though (I'm
finding them more interesting and more valuable personally).
R
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi(a)gmail.com> wrote:
You still need to define "working on what", otherwise you end up having to
waste a lot of time defining that in the moment.
General meetings still need structure, otherwise people lose sight of them having any
purpose and they tend to expand in scope and time length geometrically.
I still think sudo room would do fine simply splitting out Bureaucracy and the current
general meeting, which actually runs quite well most of the time.
On Thursday, April 25, 2013, Anthony Di Franco wrote:
That's a great idea.
Or, just separate the weekly meeting into general and working time blocks so people can
come to whichever they would like.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Marina Kukso <marina.kukso(a)gmail.com> wrote:
for the biohackers is a working meeting a hacking meeting or a meeting where business
relating to the functioning of the group gets done? because if it means the latter, then
our meeting is supposed to be that :P
Typically more of the latter, because of the stage the bio group is at, at the moment.
But as long as we're making significant progress towards having a functioning DIYbio
lab, it's all good.
We also have a "general meeting" for the East Bay DIYbio group (every last
friday - coming up tomorrow!) that is more about making introductions, exchanging cool
ideas, socializing, etc. Which is also essential for building a community, but if we only
have that kind of meetings, we'd never get any of the boring logistics done.
"General meeting" and "working meeting" is just what I've started
calling them, and nobody has called me on it yet ;-) For the first "working
meeting", we set it up over email among some of the key members, because we wanted it
small and focused enough to actually get anything done. But I think as long as we
advertize that this is a *working* meeting, and that people will be expected to contribute
and get something done, they will automatically self-select accordingly.
Maybe sudoroom needs a separate "general meeting" that is more free-form, and
not focused on rules issues etc? Heck, I might even come to those! ;-)
Patrik
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
--
Naomi Theora Most
naomi(a)nthmost.com
+1-415-728-7490
skype: nthmost
http://twitter.com/nthmost
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
sudo-discuss(a)lists.sudoroom.org
http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
--
Ryan Bethencourt
Tel: (415) 794 6463
ryan.bethencourt(a)gmail.com
www.bamh1.com
www.linkedin.com/in/bethencourt
www.logos-press.com/books/biotechnology_business_development.php
_______________________________________________
sudo-discuss mailing list
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http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
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4014
days inactive
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days old
8 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
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Anthony Di Franco -
Marina Kukso -
Naomi Most -
Patrik D'haeseleer -
Romy Ilano -
Ryan Bethencourt -
Tracy Jacobs